[Guest]

I just don't understand why the change is necessary.  If they can be operated at the same time I don't see what's the problem.  I mean that's what they're doing now, right...?  No one has really explained to me why this benefits us, is what I'm trying to say.

Yeah, this place is pretty much you and me and Emilio occasionally.

At least our convos aren't so incredibly lame.  Sometimes I think it's probably unnecessary to have two English Megaten fan communities... but then I read the posts.    

I didn't say eroguro was bad either, I just don't personally like it and view it as insultingly immature.  I only said as much.

To me, Soejima is the quintessential poseur.  His style is just so derivative, I struggle to equate it with Megaten (or Persona for that matter) at all, which in my view is/was an intensely original concept.  I tend to agree with you about the industry, but I don't think its necessarily that bad.  I actually tend to prefer retro games to new ones if my rather large Super Nintendo/original Famicom collection is any indication.

Yeah, derailed topics are fun.     Myspace is like soooo five years ago anyways.

Yeah, the place is still strong-armed by trolls.    I got a real kick out of reading an old response to a post I made though - the poster actually asserts how much smarter than me he is!!    It would've been a lot more funny if it wasn't so patently pathetic.     

What? No I'm not...  I did exactly what you're claiming to do: criticizing aspects of a game without playing it.

I'm not objecting to tit scenes either, I just think they're trite, overdone, and used to appeal to perpetually virgin school boys.  I.E. juvenile.

I just think your objections to Kaneko's recent work are just kind of vague and related more to your own personal taste rather than an objective 'fine taste.'  It's kind of weird that your attitude generally parallels my own regarding that Soejima-guy's work on the recent Persona games though.  I'm not calling Giten a bad game either, I just don't have any desire to play it based on what I've seen.  The content is immature and the artwork is ugly to boot.

Well, what I've seen of the game has led me to believe as much.  By the same token though, you shouldn't really be making the same judgments about other Megaten games without playing them: most notably Nocturne and Digital Devil Saga.  There are actually some significantly gory scenes in both and neither come off as juvenile on a whole.  Late teens/and people in their 20s perhaps, but we both fit into that demographic.  I think they are pointedly more geared to attract a female audience however, which, considering the prevailing attitudes of Japanese people and the expectation of women in Japanese society to be obnoxiously cute, it doesn't surprise me that they would have juvenile elements to them.  The Jack Brothers are a pretty perfect example of this kind of thing.

I didn't say it was improbable, just frustratingly adolescent...  I'm also not exactly psychoanalyzing it so much as making an observation.  I just don't think rape makes for a particularly compelling conceit no matter what the sex of the victim. 

I'd also argue this is precisely the kind of thing that makes it less mature than the other games in the Megami Tensei line.  I mean it would be one thing if the victim was portrayed as anything but a big titted bimbo, but as it is...  It just screams juvenile to me. 

Besides, that symbol only represents for DS1 afaik. There will be only one avatar for this scheme, for the entire DS series.

Nope, it's the symbol for Kuzunoha.  It's even the icon that shows up as your saved games for Raidou on your memory card.  It's fairly prominent in Soul Hackers too.

TBN is the Trinity Broadcasting Network, the insane Christian propaganda channel.

I meant will people still broadcast analog stations for reception on tvs that don't have converter boxes and if so it could usher in a new era of pirate broadcasting, something along the lines of HAM radio I guess.

The more I read about digital signals I don't know if I'm entirely sold on the idea.  Technically this means all the broadcast television you watch would be monitored in some way.  I mean I don't even trust broadcast networks to report accurate or intelligent news...

There's no nuance at all.  Eroguro is essentially porn with with grotesque elements.  That scene in the anime was brutal yes, but it hardly typifies the entire picture.  I think it's important to note however that this scene plays out the typical male rape fantasy wherein the victim is depicted to enjoy being raped.  I'm not offended, I just think the idea is adolescent in the extreme, playing off of male insecurity and nascent and unfulfilled sexual desires, and ultimately makes the whole scene seem rather amateurish and sexually retarded, not to mention disturbing to women who are far less likely to entertain this type of fantasy.  Regardless, I think that Atlus should make a "darker" game as well, but  I don't think injecting elements of eroguro would come anywhere close to achieving this (and would be anything but subtle).

Minimalism can be good sometimes but I don't think it fits with Megami Tensei, a pointedly weird and complex game series.  I never said that his designs weren't "out there," but I do argue it fits better with Megaten.  I don't think his method quite plays out as you describe either, but hey, you're entitled to draw your own conclusions, however based in conjecture they may be.           

What about that eyed yin yang symbol for the Kuzunoha Detective Agency?

I was kind of wondering about the wider implications of this...

Like, will private citizens be able to buy out the old broadcast channels?  I really really really like the idea of analogue piracy.  I'm sure TBN and the like will still broadcast in analogue. 

Kaneko is about as close to 'fine taste' as you're going to find in the video game/anime industry as far as I'm concerned.  I don't really think that Atlus was really that concerned with upholding the (for lack of a better word) integrity of the novel, as Shin Megami Tensei is clearly its own beast.  I'm pretty sure Aya Nishitani helped write (or actually wrote) the storyline for the Digital Devil Sagas.

Megaten has almost universally been geared towards teenagers since the first game.  There are far fewer games in the series with adult protagonists than adolescent ones, and the adults are usually barely over 20.  Some Megaten games are darker/more Satanic than others, but I don't think the presence of eroguro elements would make them any more so.  The whole concept of eroguro always seemed to me as kind of pathetic.  It's one thing to put sex and brutality together, it's entirely another to inject stereotypical ideals of women into the mix - "I'll never be able to get this ideal so I'll just rape and dismember them with my mind," is generally the statement made by eroguro.  I mean, when you say Megaten should be 'eroguro' you could just mean you want more sex and brutality in your Megaten games, which is fine, and to a certain extent I agree with you, but consider why you never see chubby women or men (on the recieving end, so to speak) in that kind of art. 

I didn't say the production values were amazing, though games are released every day with much worse art (though perhaps more polished)

That's for sure.

Thematically however, I think I prefer some straight "Eroguro" (think like the anime) to all the kid friendly in tone but with the odd subversively messed up themes interjected here in there. I love all the balls to the wall evil shit and people dying. That's life, when demons invade people are gonna die, like war. It should be more sexual as well I think. I'm fine with all the power-rangers and after-school teen specials, but give me at least one straight up series at least

To each their own I suppose.  As far as anime and manga go...  I have to admit that I kind of hate the homogeneity of the art-form.  I tend to only respect the ones that either show technical proficiency in some way or other, are just so original that they break the traditional molds, or, barring either of these, can be appreciated for sheer camp value.  There's plenty of straight-up eroguro stuff out there...  I just don't think Megaten was intended as such. 

I think you miss understand the PC-98 library. Giten is from those pictures extremely tame for a PC-98 title and the PC-98 audience. I don't think it's any more distasteful than a sex scene in an R rated film.

It didn't say it was disturbing, just distasteful.  It struck me as less art and more as a deposit in some weird, Japanese guy's spank bank.  It's one thing to show the horror of a demon invasion, even throw some sexual shit in there... But when you make it some big-boobed, bug-eyed bimbo being essentially slaughtered and raped...  It's just too pre-teen Ted Bundy to me.

Kaneko just does a different kind of art, which mostly isn't done because it's highly intensive (expensive)

You have to appreciate the subtleties of the anime if you're going to appreciate it. If anything, Kaneko totally lacks sudtlety. I thought Persona was brilliant, though obviously in a different vein. His SMTI&II stuff was very solid. But I think DS/SH were too ambitious. And from there he just spiraled into a total obliviousness. My guess is somewhere along the line an artist's ego gives out, and if no one is there to set them straight, they just become unable to critique/doubt their own impulses... and ultimately their art suffers. 

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by 'subtle.'  I'm pretty sure we've covered this ground before - I feel essentially the opposite.  He's only gotten better since the early Shin Megaten days.  I didn't think he was ambitious enough.  Now there's an almost draftsman's quality to what he does.  Everything is crisp and clean and, most importantly, not colored with markers.

I think baby steps at this point is probably the best policy.  Truth be told the Megaten community tends to be spread out quite a bit.  I mean the Persona games may as well be their own fandom by now.  This place is pretty dead too you have to admit.

I'll see what I can do as far as avatars go.  Any particular size?