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Author Topic: SMT "Combat System"...Any info? (Read 10835 times)
giantbadger
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giantbadger says,
 « on: February 16, 2007, 10:07:14 AM »
I've been trying to program an SMT-based online text RPG using the Byond programming system ( www.byond.com ), and it's easy enough, but one thing is bugging me that I can't seem to work out correctly...

...and that's the "combat system."

I'm talking about hit rates, damage calculation for attacks and spells, and even evasion of spells.

I've been using http://hkaityo.hp.infoseek.co.jp/dq/index.html for statistics/resistances and such (as well as a most-excellent "Soul Hackers" strategy guide), but a concrete way to "re-program" the battle system without the data it getting, well, weird.

For a better description of what I mean, take a look at the following areas of Gamefaqs, and the designated files:

Final Fantasy VII - Battle Mechanics FAQ:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/game/197341.html

Final Fantasy IX - Battle Mechanics FAQ:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/game/197338.html

Skies of Arcadia - Special Items FAQ:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/dreamcast/game/197237.html

Phantasy Star IV - Technical Guide:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/genesis/game/563334.html

There are probably more guides like that, but I just wanted to give you some background on exactly what I was looking for.

Does anyone have such a guide, or know detailed data about how to:

(a) faithfully duplicate hit ratios
(b) faithfully calculate damage for regular attacks and magic attacks
(c) any other base data that I should know about?



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Camanche
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Camanche says,
 « Reply #1 on: February 18, 2007, 08:40:26 AM »
There is an online RP that is text-based already, but it is only Nocturne and it's not as technical as yours (battle are just written out). More story and character based as well. I'm working on a programming thing for the Mac that might help with what you're trying to do though. I'll get back to you in a week when I have a better grasp of everything.

(If you are interested in the Nocturne RP, click on my sig.)



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giantbadger
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giantbadger says,
 « Reply #2 on: February 21, 2007, 08:11:47 AM »
Thanks for the reply.

Unlike an RPG on a message board (which I assume yours is, after brief viewing), I'm making it an actual "game," in which I mean a MUD or MMORPG (take your pick of term).

I've tried to do some text-work on certain test data, but overall, I guess I'm just going to have to program my own battle system.  It won't be very faithful, but that's one of the breaks.  It also tends to be very violent at times (i.e. large amounts of damage being dished out sometimes), but itsn't that SMT fare? :corkysm17



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Tony
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Tony says,
 « Reply #3 on: February 21, 2007, 10:02:12 AM »
So basically you're kind of looking for percentage information? Like if someone has this much magic defense, it blocks this much of the magic's attack power?

I don't know that anyone (at least in English) has actually bothered to do that. I would imagine that you could kind of adapt it from another title... when it really gets down to it, it's very similar to other RPGs in terms of basic stats. The main thing I think you should really pay attention to are super specific weaknesses, which have obviously become very important in SMT related titles... moreso than other RPGs I've played.




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giantbadger says,
 « Reply #4 on: February 21, 2007, 10:34:47 AM »
I'm trying to hunt down all the exact "formulas" for doing specific things.

Let's take combat, for example.

If I have a 120 attack, and the creature I'm hitting has a 200 defense, I've seen cases where I'm doing in the 80s of damage.

The formula is what I'm looking for.  Something like:

Damage = (ATTACK * 3) - (DEFENSE) (Which is the formula I'm using now, which is not based on any other particular game per-se)

Weakness/etc. are fine, as they are based on a simple formula as well:

Final.Damage = Sub.Damage * (Applicable.Resistance / 100) (Where Applicable.Resistance ranges from -200 to 200.  Negative ranges reflect the damage, 0 = immune, 100 is affected as normal and less than that is less effective, and greater than 100 means a weakness to the particular attack)  (All from http://hkaityo.hp.infoseek.co.jp/dq/index.html )

If Final.Damage = 0, no damage done (Immune)
If Final.Damage > 0, and the enemy doesn't absorb that kind of damage, deal that amount of damage.  Otherwise, restore that amount of HP to the taget. (Affected by the attack)
If Final.Damage < 0, Final.Damage = Final.Damage * -1, and do that damage back at the attacker. (Reflects the attack)



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Tony
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Tony says,
 « Reply #5 on: February 21, 2007, 12:31:33 PM »
Yeah, to be completely honest, I don't think anyone has taken the time to actually do that. You might want to check some of the larger Persona 2 FAQs if you haven't, but I'm pretty sure there's nothing like that in there either.

Sounds like you might be stuck just experiementing... but this is a really cool idea, so definitely let us know of your progress either way. I'd be willing to help you test out stuff to get other people's viewpoints if necessary.




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giantbadger says,
 « Reply #6 on: February 21, 2007, 10:58:02 PM »
First of all, I guess I should just warn everyone who may be reading this that the game is one of the old-style, text games.  No graphical capabilities.  Right now, it makes it a whole lot easier to play and program.

>Tony:

As for the game itself, it might need to be hosted at some time.

>Everyone else:

Since I'm here, I might as well ask everyone: is there a particular creature(s) from the SMT world that you feel must be included in this online game?  You can put your thoughts in this thread.



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Jessicat says,
 « Reply #7 on: February 22, 2007, 01:48:23 AM »
Quote from: giantbadger
First of all, I guess I should just warn everyone who may be reading this that the game is one of the old-style, text games.  No graphical capabilities.  Right now, it makes it a whole lot easier to play and program.

>Everyone else:

Since I'm here, I might as well ask everyone: is there a particular creature(s) from the SMT world that you feel must be included in this online game?  You can put your thoughts in this thread.
Taking suggestions for demons? Yay! (this could get to being a long list :P)
I think Barong should be included, (and Rangda too of course), Jack Frost (duh), Qing Long, Gyu-Ki, Naga, Raja Naga, Cerberus, Orthos, Shi-Sa (the little Foo dog), Samael, Mishaguji (giant salamander), Raiju, Orochi, Susano, Terrasque (without the booze XD), CuChulain, Pyro Jack, Oni, Beelzebub, Belial, and Ganesha. Those are all that I can think of right now that should be included XD I don't know if remembering most of those names is cool or scary nolaff
Will this game involve negotiations too? That would be neat, and no images required :3 Good luck with this project! And Giantbadger is a cool username, I think you should make a cameo as a demon too. It'd be better than Dante XD
Eep, I almost forgot, (should've known this'd happen), add Lamia too XD



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giantbadger says,
 « Reply #8 on: February 22, 2007, 03:57:19 AM »
>Jessicat:

The creatures that I have lined up (still looking through the lists for creatures of various strengths to balance dungeon exploring) are as follows.  Some are still being entered into the game.  Most are from SMT1, 2 and if..., but a handful are based on their Nocturne counterparts.

Zombie Dog
Poltergeist
Pixie
Slime
Zombie-Kun
Gremlin
Zombie-Chan
Bodyconian
Goblin
Kobold
Jack Frost
Jack Latern
Angel
Elf
Dark Elf
Lilim
Archangel
Maneater
Dryad
Troll
Valkyrie
Succubus
Amazon
Vampire
Joan of Arc
Chu Chulain
Dominion
Water
Power
Principality
Chris The Car
Jack Ripper
Yatagarasu
Cyclops
Ogre
Incubus
Tengu
Old One
Nyarlathotep
Lucifer
Seiryu
Byakko
Genbu
Suzaku
Yamata-No-Orochi
Shiva
Susano
Masakado
Beelzebub
Astaroth
Strawberry Frost
Lemon Frost
Milky Frost
Melon Frost
Blue Hawaii Frost
Frost Five
Alice
Dante
White Rider
Red Rider
Black Rider
Pale Rider
Mother Harlot

I can't tell you about the bosses that have already added, since I don't know which ones will appear where, when or if.  Had an idea for a sidequest involving the "Fox" bosses from if...

A number of ones that you have mentioned have been added, but the probably is, I don't know how long the game will be, so I have to balance content with length.  Of course, the game can be updated at a later time; however, I'd like to make sure it's playable to a certain degree before I throw everything I have into it.

I might be able to get a version of the game up next month or so, if Tony might be willing to host it.  However, since it's an online game, it might eat up some bandwidth.  This could be offset by the fact that the Byond system allows for subscriptions.  Most of the game could be free, but any farther would take a fee (purely to deal with bandwidth, of course)...



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Tony
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Tony says,
 « Reply #9 on: February 22, 2007, 11:41:58 AM »
I'm more than willing to host it. Bandwidth isn't much of a concern to be quite honest, as long as 1,500 don't suddenly want to play it at once lol. Just let me know what's involved whenever that time comes.

Demon wise I think you have most of the ones people would expect to see. Maybe toss a Kodama in there.




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giantbadger
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giantbadger says,
 « Reply #10 on: February 23, 2007, 05:59:57 AM »
Well, Kodama are pretty weak, but it's not hard to add them.

I'll do some research to see what needs to be done to put it on a site.  It might consume some system resources to run it, however...

Anyone else have any other suggestions?



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Tony
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Tony says,
 « Reply #11 on: February 23, 2007, 11:48:57 AM »
Actually... Maybe I'm missing it in your list, but a possible inclusion would by YHWH himself. Obviously that's not much of a Nocturne issue, but since you're including older games it would work.

At the same time, I'm not sure if you've already considered that as some sort of boss element that you've not listed there.




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giantbadger says,
 « Reply #12 on: February 24, 2007, 02:09:32 PM »
Well, I could add YHWH to the game, but any sort of plot element would have to involve getting to that point.

Then again, He doesn't have to be included at all.  Soul Hackers didn't include YHWH or Lucifer at all, so it's not as if He would have to make an appearance at all.  Heck, even Megaten 1 didn't have YHWH (though 2 did).

Even the version that could be release next month probably wouldn't even go that far.  Just a minor Beta to see if everything works out, then add more as bugs are ironed out.

Since there isn't much traffic here, maybe I should also post something at Megaten Haven as well, to get more ideas.



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giantbadger has 7 Posts (+10/-0 Karma)
Tony
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Tony says,
 « Reply #13 on: February 24, 2007, 05:03:29 PM »
Quote from: giantbadger
Since there isn't much traffic here, maybe I should also post something at Megaten Haven as well, to get more ideas.

Yeah, that's a good idea. I'd also honestly try for GameFAQs/Gamespot as well.




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granitor says,
 « Reply #14 on: March 09, 2007, 07:59:04 PM »
This sounds like an interesting project.

I was thinking about working on a mapper for SMT1, but that's about it. My free time is limited so I wouldn't want to try anything to involved right now.

The combat system thing sounds interesting, and BYOND is a good language to do it in, from what little I played with it. Well, not only the language but the builting libs that make RPG/MMO/Text-adventure game making so painless.

Good luck with the project and please post when there's something playable.



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