DIGITAL_DEVIL_DATABASE Community Forum

Post Apocalyptic Hellscape => The Underground => Topic started by: surft on October 06, 2008, 09:06:17 AM



Title: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: surft on October 06, 2008, 09:06:17 AM
Are the Mods accepting volunteer research work for the Demonary? (Since its been taking so long to for it to appear on the site, no offense intended)
I'm willing to help :smile:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on October 06, 2008, 09:30:02 AM
Well, of course! I can use some help, just let me know what you want to do regarding the Demonary and we're going to discuss it.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on October 06, 2008, 09:39:10 AM
Yes we will be needing help from everyone once the interface is up. Emilio has a large spreadsheet of games he's compiled. I think it would be a fine time to start discussing it, while I try to relay some information about the system itself.

It will take me a little while to get around to working on the Demonary system. I won't let it languish for years like the original administration did however. There is a system there, it has just never been opened up to the public really afaik.

That said, for now I can't testify the system is airtight, and I still haven't fully reviewed it's programming to my satisfaction. However I'm aware of what is basically there.


In the meantime I think there is still a need to discuss what the Demonary should actually look/feel like, and even start picking at the bones so to speak of the finer details, such as stat/field names and all the standardizations which will be required to accomplish the Demonary.



To start I'd like everyone to try to find multiple sources online that list the stats of Devils for all games in Japanese and English if applicable. It's not necessary the source be at all comprehensive. I just wanna see some physical evidence of the stats for every game.

On the other hand, in the earliest stages of hammering out, stats are gonna be more secondary to names and graphics I think. Though I'd like to have all the information in front of me, in case I decide it will be more difficult to alter the database midstream so to speak.


Further confounding things, I still need some access codes from Jose in order fully install PHPma (it currently only permits readonly operations basically)

I'm pretty sure I can get by without PHPma, but it will be trickier and require more research on my part. I'm not positive Jose can even get these codes, but I reckon he could if he really tried. I might try contacting the host provider directly.


edited: Right now the site layout itself is a higher priority. And I tend to only be able to focus on one thing at a time, in the limited time I have to address these matters...


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 02, 2008, 08:21:46 PM
Is anyone out there working on compiling database info?

I just want everyone to know, just because we're not physically working on getting the databases up at the moment, it doesn't mean you can't be collecting data. That is after all the vast amount of work involved in compiling the database.

I think I have an idea of how the databases will work, but just working with Wordpress I've realized database programming is more alien to my know-how than I initially suspected. I have a number of books I'll need to read over before confidently proceeding. At the moment a lot of my working time is spent preparing to set sail for some traveling, but as soon as I'm on my way I will probably crack open some books. SQL is pretty mind bending compared to most other types of programming. Basically operations are not limited to single units of data, but instead work on giant multi-dimensional sets of data at the same time. The concept might sound really straight forward, but it's actually pretty counter-intuitive.

At any rate, my plan so far is the databases should be fully integrated with the main site. So what I intend to do is have devil information or whatever popup very much like what Tony's lightbox system does with images. In fact for esthetic purposes the presentation will basically be identical. There will be special pages that will sort lists of devils based on different criteria (probably any information you want in the database) ...but to see info on a devil you'll have to click on a name in the list and wait for the popup. Basically I don't think long pages of images and complex data is appropriate. Whatever search criteria used will also be displayed in the listing page, but that is it.

Similarly any page can contain links to devils which should generate a lightbox popup. Once in the lightbox mode there will be another button inside the lightbox frame to skip from appearances of the same devil in other games (including localizations -- though probably by a different but similar means) ...skipping from devil to devil from a listing page will be just like a lightbox gallery.

There will also have to be a barebone backend for users on browsers that can't handle lightbox for technical or performance reasons. But I suspect it will just be a bleak white on black page with an image.... basically same as what's inside lightbox but unstyled.


What to do about letting users edit the databases however I have absolutely no idea. In fact if we ever get there, it will be pretty impressive. I'll look at what Tony cooked up, but I don't think that is an ultimately acceptable solution. I could put it behind a passcode protected url however and hope for the best. Ultimately it would require a proper user authentication/accounting system and a some sort of revision tracking. Tony might have a generic CMS setup somewhere, but I'm not positive.

Therefore I figure the best way to do things for now is to just keep a master file for each database and occasionally completely overwrite the databases as new data is added to each file.


Perhaps one way to collaborate on databases is an online spreadsheet system I've seen people use before. Perhaps if Emilio could get his databases into one of these systems that would be a start.


PS: I'd really like to kick things off with a Persona1 Personae database if anyone is up to starting something new (I'd just have more fun debugging everything with the P1 Persona set) ...btw we could just use the card graphics. But if anyone want's to splice together the battle graphics, I can probably simulate the in-game ghosting effect by accumulating the images in the browser window.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 02, 2008, 08:37:38 PM
I dunno, something like this:

http://googlesystem.blogspot.com/2008/05/google-spreadsheets-become-wikis.html

I've no idea what the best solution is, or time to shop around. Whatever you choose, you'll either want full control over edit revisions, or you'd have to fully trust everyone involved. Also keep regular backups of exports, and make sure you compare the differences each time... use a diff app if one is not an online feature.

Ultimately I'll need text only csv files to import into our databases. Keep a separate database for each game. Once someone figures all of that out, let me know.


Before you get started you should choose a project leader to manage the spreadsheets... and it doesn't have to be the person who will do most of the population work. It should be the person who is most comfortable with internet technology / using the internet for projects in general. I don't have time to deal with this stuff.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 02, 2008, 10:43:26 PM
Tony seems to have graphics and statscreens for every Persona in Eternal Punishment. If anyone could use them I'll make a link to a zip file available.

Personally I like the backs of the tarot cards, but not a whole lot else :hearton:

edited: Not positive they're the best quality image/artifacts wise... you be the judge:

(http://www.digitaldevildb.com/images/persona/2ep/judgement/michael_stats.png)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 04, 2008, 10:18:05 PM
Can everyone see this?

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=piKSlpkg0llAny-VoXNRkKQ#


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 04, 2008, 10:23:47 PM
Since the Persona (ペルソナ) spread sheet is empty, why don't you start fresh on it and see if we can't pin down a format first before filling it in.

You could start by telling me everything that should be in a P1 Personae database...

edit: I don't really have any experience working with spreadsheets, but I can work out a layout. I figure it is possible to hand code something to rearrange a layout after the fact, so maybe I could help you do that with some of the old databases some day.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 04, 2008, 10:27:01 PM
I can see it, but it's a pain in the ass let that thing load. Anyway, I'm not able to modify anything in that link, of course, if it's possible.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 04, 2008, 10:33:05 PM
I can see it, but it's a pain in the ass let that thing load. Anyway, I'm not able to modify anything in that link, of course, if it's possible.

It loads fast for me. I sent an invite earlier... to your registered hotmail address. If you follow it's instructions you'll be able to edit.

I can't seem to find a way to make the spreadsheet organize itself in terms of sub blocks. I don't have any substantial spreadsheet experience...

I think the sanest way to organize things however is definitely one devil per row.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 04, 2008, 10:40:01 PM
I can see it, but it's a pain in the ass let that thing load. Anyway, I'm not able to modify anything in that link, of course, if it's possible.

It loads fast for me. I sent an invite earlier... to your registered hotmail address. If you follow it's instructions you'll be able to edit.

I can't seem to find a way to make the spreadsheet organize itself in terms of sub blocks. I don't have any substantial spreadsheet experience...

I think the sanest way to organize things however is definitely one devil per row.

I needed to create an account at google first, now that I have one I can modify the document. :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 12:09:47 AM
Ok, I setup the Personae spreadsheet best I could...

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=piKSlpkg0llAny-VoXNRkKQ&hl=en

If there are other stats I'm missing they can be added later.

It might seem very simple, but we really need it this way so the entire database isn't broken by a bad edit.

Each row starting with a number is a Personae (the number is it's level)

Any row starting with a ! cell is a description of the last Personae encountered. We can also use that line for special information if needed.

You can put whatever you want in other rows as long as the first cell isn't a number or ! (exclamation point) ...such rows will be treated as notes or decoration and ignored.

You can add images if you want (they don't seem to effect anything and they're not part of the cells) but they have to be hosted online.

I will generate file names from the Japanese names somehow.

All that matters in the Arcana columns is the number be right. The rest of the cell will be ignored. That is the arcana text notation is for reference.

For now for skill, affinity, and item names use either the english or japanese name (or both in the same cell) it doesn't matter, just separate them with semicolons (;)

edited: Beginning spaces will be ignored^

Good luck :smokin:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 09:13:31 AM
Wow, that thing is huge compared to my template! :eek: Are we going to use this same template to the other games? I will try to look for any site that has the info of the stats of each Persona, if you have any, let me know :wink: If not, I guess I will need the game too look at the stats, but it will be a pain in the ass :sick:

EDIT: And if we're going to use the same template to the other games, I can, in the meanwhile, export your template to the other games since the info is already there.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 10:16:24 AM
If there's no problem with it, I want to star with the data of the Personas from "Persona 2 Eternal Punishment" since I have all the data with me. I will duplicate the page and start working in that.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 05:30:18 PM
Sure you can use the same setup for other games, but be careful to plan ahead before you start going crazy. Fortunately the arrangement I've chosen is very forgiving.

I don't think your P1 Devils are right btw, not sure where you got those (other than from another game)

There is a FAQ for revelations on the site that appears to have most of the Personae stats in Tony's P1 FAQs area.

Btw, I made some changes last night. You're already far ahead so it's up to you really. But I went ahead and merged the skill cells together because I thought it would take up less space. If you want to do it that way, just separate every skill with a semicolon and use something to represent a level with no new skill, ie. --, for example. You can leave off skills for the final levels if you don't know them or there aren't any.

Also recognize for names, the "English" name is basically a translation (probably the same as would appear in the Encyclopedia), the other names cells are for the Japanese name (in katakana) and the Atlus USA Revelations name. We will probably name the images after the English name instead of the Atlus USA name.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 05:32:17 PM
As for the layout of the spreadsheet, it's setup to be easily read by machines, not people :biggrin:

It's also setup so if someone does something wrong it won't effect the rest of the spreadsheet.

PS: In the Recipe field just add the special item needed, except for the high level Personae which require exactly two cards and two cards only. You can add those cards to the end. We can probably compute the cards for the others based on their arcana.

Also the Return cell is for the item you get when deleting the persona.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 05:40:22 PM
Sure you can use the same setup for other games, but be careful to plan ahead before you start going crazy. Fortunately the arrangement I've chosen is very forgiving.

Don't worry, I guess I will work one game at a time, so if I need your opinion about somethin, I'll let you know.

I don't think your P1 Devils are right btw, not sure where you got those (other than from another game)

There is a FAQ for revelations on the site that appears to have most of the Personae stats in Tony's P1 FAQs area.

I'm working on the "Eternal Punishment" demonary right now, so don't mind those demons on the P1 sheet, they're from Eternal Punishment, but I made a mistake so I just copy them in the P1 sheet for a while.

Btw, I made some changes last night. You're already far ahead so it's up to you really. But I went ahead and merged the skill cells together because I thought it would take up less space. If you want to do it that way, just separate every skill with a semicolon and use something to represent a level with no new skill, ie. --, for example. You can leave off skills for the final levels if you don't know them or there aren't any.

If there's no problem with you, I guess I will keep the spells in one cell separated with semicolons for now. I will modify what I have until now. I will need help with some of the spell names from most of the demons/Personas, since I'm using "Google Traductor" to translate the pages to english, some spell names doesn't look well or have a different name, so I just put an asterisk on those spells that I'm not sure if they're correct.

Also recognize for names, the "English" name is basically a translation (probably the same as would appear in the Encyclopedia), the other names cells are for the Japanese name (in katakana) and the Atlus USA Revelations name. We will probably name the images after the English name instead of the Atlus USA name.

Ok, by now I just put both the English name and the Japanese names below the cell "English" separated by semicolons. I will take care of it in the future. :wink:

ALSO, I have a lot of empty cells by now, just give me some time to find the name of the items in english. I want to write all the "important" or "most easy to handle" information before putting things like the Returning Item, Flavor Texts and so on. But don't worry, I'll take care of it as soon as I can. :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 05:46:58 PM
Don't worry about translating anything yourself. If there is already a translation somewhere like on this page:

http://www.sumarucity.com/megami/wiki/index.php?title=Persona_Name_Changes

Go ahead and use that, but we have more comfortable translators (such as myself) worry about verifying translations and filling in the gaps. If you put in a bad translation it might take more time for us to follow your lead.

Just make sure you fill in the cells for the exact names used in the games. Try to get one or both if you can.


It's very important the words used in the skills and etcetera appear just as they do in the synonym table. So if it isn't too much trouble every time you come to a new name you should add it to the synonym table (find where it goes alphabetically and insert it)

That will be are way of knowing what words mean what across different versions of the game. And possibly even more. Eventually all of the game information will probably end up in the same database. Don't worry about putting Persona and devil names in the synonym table for now however.

The synonym table is just a lightweight way to keep track of everything until we have a detailed table for everything.

PS: The alphabetizing of the synonym table is to make it easier for editors to avoid double entries. It doesn't have to be alphabetized for technical reasons.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 05:49:48 PM
Roger that. For now, just let me build the skeleton of the Demonary, then I will add the details and corrections.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 06:31:55 PM
Roger that. For now, just let me build the skeleton of the Demonary, then I will add the details and corrections.

While you're at it, I recommend you order Personae by their levels instead of arcana. I know it might be counter intuitive, but it's easier to quickly find a Persona by level and all the databases might as well be consistent, and levels are the common denominator. And level is the first cell in each row after all.

Also be careful not to use the "sort by" options, as they'll probably mess up all the commenting rows -- though my guess is you could surely undo that, but if not undone it might mess up the database permanently except for rolling it back to a good revision.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 07:19:33 PM
Roger that. For now, just let me build the skeleton of the Demonary, then I will add the details and corrections.

While you're at it, I recommend you order Personae by their levels instead of arcana. I know it might be counter intuitive, but it's easier to quickly find a Persona by level and all the databases might as well be consistent, and levels are the common denominator. And level is the first cell in each row after all.

Also be careful not to use the "sort by" options, as they'll probably mess up all the commenting rows -- though my guess is you could surely undo that, but if not undone it might mess up the database permanently except for rolling it back to a good revision.

By level then? Ok. I will write all the Personas by arcana for now, then I'll re-arrenge them later. Btw, I was thinking if the site provides you with a "Backup" of all the info, 'cause just imagine if someone just follows the link and starts deleting info O_O that wouldn't be so great!  :nolaff:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 07:36:56 PM
It keeps track of all changes. For now you have to ask permission to edit it them. It's possible they should all be in separate documents so editors can just get permission to work on one at a time. But we worry about that later.

In the meantime, I advise you to rearrange your rows by level now if you intend to, because rearranging it in the future might be very complicated and tedious :sweatdrop:

Also you should prepare them for others to help with as well :rainbow:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 07:45:54 PM
In the meantime, I advise you to rearrange your rows by level now if you intend to, because rearranging it in the future might be very complicated and tedious :sweatdrop:

Yeah, you have a good point in there! But the problem is when I'm typing the info it would be a greater pain to search in all the demons/Persona database of each game and re-arrenge them by level, and then write the info in the demonary since most of the sites you just find them by tarot affinity. So if you want in the meanwhile I can sort them by level in the tarot they belong and then, if I still have the will to do it, I can sort them again by level. (or someone can help me with sorting things out for us)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 08:00:01 PM
If you can find one site listed by level it's not that hard. I understand though, but there isn't a whole lot to be done about it. Just be glad Persona lists tend to be shorter than Devil lists :hearton:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 08:01:56 PM
Also it's not at all hard to add them in the order of your list, but just find the place where their level belongs and insert some rows. If you want to further sort the ones of the same level by arcana that's up to you.

After the database is setup they can be sorted however. Mostly it's easier to sort them by level because the first column is so slim.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 08:14:00 PM
Well, with the demonary I'm working right now, I'm including devils too. Both Personas and Devils from P2:EP Both don't your worry! I'll add them by tarot and then I'll do what you said, just look, add some rows and paste the devil/Persona. :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 08:20:27 PM
Before you add devils let me review your layout.

Btw, the information you're inputting doesn't seem to jive with Tony's screenshots for the most part. Are you sure you're sources are good?

You're not putting devils in the same table are you? We'll actually probably have to make separate spreadsheets for enemies in the Persona games, because you're pretty well stuck to the column boundaries, and it could get ugly if you tried to squeaze everything into one spreadsheet.

This is probably the last I'll post tonight on these matters. I might be away for a few days as well on the road.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 08:25:38 PM
You can look at the links I put on the sheet, those 2 are my sources. And if you want me to do a Persona chart and then a Devil chart, is fine with me, better if you say it now and not when I'm done. :sweatdrop:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 08:33:03 PM
Woops, I think I deleted those links :redface:

You hadn't changed the link descriptions so I figured they were the same P1 links.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 08:43:58 PM
Well, I'll post them tomorrow, since I have those in the other computer!  :smug:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 05, 2008, 09:14:34 PM
I can find the urls in the revision history, but I'm a little busy atm, and I wouldn't have time to review them regardless. When you do make a copy of a spreadsheet, try to get rid of all the old info first :wink:

Make sure you look these over before going too far:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/images/persona/2ep/2ep.zip

Wait a little while for that file to finish uploading...


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 05, 2008, 09:24:56 PM
I will use those images for the stats and spells and the other site for the Japanese names. Thanks :tongue:

EDIT: I thought those images have the spells too. :geno:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 10, 2008, 04:59:19 AM
I will use those images for the stats and spells and the other site for the Japanese names. Thanks :tongue:

EDIT: I thought those images have the spells too. :geno:
I just have what Tony had on the site. Sorry :frown:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 10, 2008, 09:04:12 AM
Don't worry about it, :wink: I guess I'll have to play to write the spells with the correct name. The Persona 2 Batsu's demonary is almost complete (only Personas) once I finish with it, I'll began working with the demons of the same game or sort the Personas by level, it all depends if I have the will to do it at this moment. :rolleyes:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 10, 2008, 11:20:02 AM
There, the Demonary for Batsu (only Personas) is already completed (not 100% completed yet), if anyone wants to help me with the names of spell, then be my guest (the ones with asterisks (*)). Once the names are ready, I will began sorting them by level, and then I'll start with the same demonary but with the demons in it.

In other words, the structure of the demonary is ready, I only need to fix the spell names and add other info that is missing, Non Compat (I guess this one is "non compatible, right?) and Return.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 10, 2008, 09:12:26 PM
I dunno... surely you shouldn't have to play. There should be a faq with the names somewhere. If not in English, definitely in Japanese. It would be easier to just list the Japanese names and translate them later than "playing the game."

Non-compat is for types of skills Personae can never inherit. I dunno if that is part of P2 but one of the Japanese sites lists these stats for P1. For instance a fire based persona maybe can't use ice??

The four empty fields you've not filled in are for magic attack and defense, and physical attack and defense (Persona 1 only has magic for personae so I added the two for P2 -- I called them MAG/INT/ATK/DEF)



Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 11, 2008, 10:20:37 AM
The four empty fields you've not filled in are for magic attack and defense, and physical attack and defense (Persona 1 only has magic for personae so I added the two for P2 -- I called them MAG/INT/ATK/DEF)

:doh: You're right about those 4. Anyway, I'll have to replace the MAG and INT with SAt. and SDf.

EDIT: Before I start changing the MAG to SAt. and adding At. and Df. to the sheets, those anyone knows if this stats are the same always, or they change with the rank ups?


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 11, 2008, 11:42:26 PM
The stats work just like MAG/INT. SAt etcetera might be more confusing, but it's not a big deal either way.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 28, 2008, 11:10:55 AM
Ok, finally after dealing with some viruses on both computers I was able to keep working with the P2 Demonary. The only thing that is missing the the row of "Non-Compat" since I don't know what to put in it. The only thing we (or "I") need to do is rearrange the Personas by level as you requested, but if anyone is not willing to do it, I'll keep an eye on that in a while. :goodnight: In the meantime, I will look for the info for the "Soul Hackers" Demonary. :rolleyes:



Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 28, 2008, 12:48:45 PM
Let me know before you get too far so I can approve the layout of new spreadsheets ok. I think this basic format is pretty forgiving, but I'd still like to make sure everything looks right. Also have some links I can use in the top part of the spreadsheet please.

Non-compat is the types of skills a Persona can never use. P2 Personae might not be limited that way, but apparently P1 Personae were.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 28, 2008, 03:45:37 PM
Oh! I see, thanks for clearing things out for me! :wink: And don't worry, I'll let you know when I'm going to work with the layout of Soul Hackers. But I guess I'll start with sorting the P2 Demonary by level, just one question. I'm planing on creating a new sheet and then just "cut", "paste" the Personas from one  sheet to the other, so in that way it would be much easier. Now, is this okay with you or do you have any issue with it? :rainbow:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 28, 2008, 04:03:54 PM
Oh! I see, thanks for clearing things out for me! :wink: And don't worry, I'll let you know when I'm going to work with the layout of Soul Hackers. But I guess I'll start with sorting the P2 Demonary by level, just one question. I'm planing on creating a new sheet and then just "cut", "paste" the Personas from one  sheet to the other, so in that way it would be much easier. Now, is this okay with you or do you have any issue with it? :rainbow:

It isn't technically necessary they be sorted in any way. But it would look more consistent. As long as you are the primary maintainer of the spreadsheets it is up to you. It is a good idea to think about the future, but if you feel like doing something else instead in the meantime that is fine too.

I'm going to be using the P1 spreadsheet for debugging. I don't mind if you feel like filling it in while I'm at it.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on November 28, 2008, 05:22:15 PM
I'm going to be using the P1 spreadsheet for debugging. I don't mind if you feel like filling it in while I'm at it.

Ok, if you don't mind, I guess I'll start working with the P1 sheet with the links you write in there. But I guess I will look at this  on Monday, since in a few minutes I'm out to my house :smug: and I need to work on my manga. :razz:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on November 30, 2008, 05:12:43 PM
I have the CSV export fully parsed:

Input:
Code:
DIGITAL DEVIL DATABASE www.digitaldevildb.com
"Personae Database for Megami Ibunroku Persona ""Be Your True Mind"" and Revelations: Persona"
Some Useful Online Links:,,,,,,,,,URLs:
Revelations: Persona to English and in-game names in romaji:,,,,,,,,,http://www.sumarucity.com/megami/wiki/index.php?title=Persona_Name_Changes
Megami Ibunroku personae names in katakana by level:,,,,,,,,,http://fool-est.hp.infoseek.co.jp/persona/ibunroku/data/lv_persona.html
Revelations: Persona personae stats:,,,,,,,,,http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/file/198277/4086
Editing Guidelines:
"- Columns marked with asterisks, ie. *, are required to be filled. This probably only applies in the first column."
"- Table beginning rows are yellow, legends are grey, information is white, and notes are purple."
"- Synonym rows start with the dollar sign, ie. $, personae rows begin with a number, the persona's level, and persona descriptions begin with an exclamation point, ie. !"
"- Never use commas, ie. (,) for now... as commas make processing the .csv file considerably more complicated."
Synonyms Table Alphabetically Sorted by Revelations Titles
*,Revelations,,English Translation,,,,Megami,,,,functions,,,,,reserved,,,,,notes
$,Hell Book,,Book of the Dead,,,,閻魔帳,,,,item,,,,,,,,,,A recipe item.   閻魔帳 is a book used by Yama to judge the dead; and can also humorously mean a class grades ledger -- the teacher assuming the role of Yama in this play on words.
Personae Table Sorted According to Persona Level
*,Names,,,Tarot,,Growth,Non-,Items,,Stats,,,,,,,Skills,,,,,,,Affinity
Lv,English,Megami,Revelations,Arcana,SP,Pattern,Compat,Recipe,Return,STR,VIT,TEC,AGL,LUC,MAG,INT,Lv1,Lv2,Lv3,Lv4,Lv5,Lv6,Lv7,Weak,Resist,Immune,Reflect,Drain,Type
4,Yama ,ヤマ,Trickster,5 Heiro.,3,大器晩成B型,降魔,Hell Book,パララマストーン,15,17,12,15,7,55,55,Duel Sword; DEF up; Spirit norm; Holyer; STR up,,,,,,,,Magic,,,,Holylight; Exorcism
!,All we know about Yama here...
*,Names,,,Tarot,,Growth,Non-,Items,,Stats,,,,,,,Skills,,,,,,,Affinity
Lv,English,Megami,Revelations,Arcana,SP,Pattern,Compat,Recipe,Return,STR,VIT,TEC,AGL,LUC,MAG,INT,Lv1,Lv2,Lv3,Lv4,Lv5,Lv6,Lv7,Weak,Resist,Immune,Reflect,Drain,Type
4,Pixie,ピクシー,Pixie,6 Lovers,2,ピクシー専用型,地震,,LUKインセンス,5,10,7,16,18,42,63,Cure; Wind; Happy Dance; Flash; Star Punch; Bolt,,,,,,,Physical,,,Wind,,Elemental; Air
!,All we know about Pixie here...

Output:
Code:
php test ok!
preview ok!
importing...
found 23 rows...
26 Synonyms imported...
ITEM Book of the Dead
閻魔帳 / Hell Book
 A recipe item. 閻魔帳 is a book used by Yama to judge the dead; and can also humorously mean a class grades ledger -- the teacher assuming the role of Yama in this play on words. generated!
TYPE unknown
大器晩成B型 / missing
 generated!
TYPE unknown
降魔 / missing
 generated!
ITEM unknown
パララマストーン / missing
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Duel Sword
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / DEF up
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Spirit norm
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Holyer
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / STR up
 generated!
TYPE unknown
知りない / Magic
 generated!
TYPE unknown
知りない / Holylight
 generated!
TYPE unknown
知りない / Exorcism
 generated!
PERSONA Yama
ヤマ / Trickster
 generated!
TYPE unknown
ピクシー専用型 / missing
 generated!
TYPE unknown
地震 / missing
 generated!
ITEM unknown
LUKインセンス / missing
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Cure
 generated!
TYPE unknown
知りない / Wind
 generated! generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Happy Dance
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Flash
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Star Punch
 generated!
SKILL unknown
知りない / Bolt
 generated!
TYPE unknown
知りない / Physical
 generated!
TYPE unknown
知りない / Elemental
 generated!
TYPE unknown
知りない / Air
 generated!
PERSONA Pixie
ピクシー / Pixie
 generated!
2 Personae imported...
Hierophant Yama
ヤマ / Trickster
 All we know about Yama here...
大器晩成B型; 降魔; Book of the Dead; パララマストーン
15STR 17VIT 12TEC 15AGL 7LUC 55MAG 55INT
STR up, Holyer, Spirit norm, DEF up, Duel Sword;
unknown(0); Magic; unknown(0); unknown(0); unknown(0);
Holylight Exorcism
Lovers Pixie
ピクシー / Pixie
 All we know about Pixie here...
ピクシー専用型; 地震; unknown(0); LUKインセンス
5STR 10VIT 7TEC 16AGL 18LUC 42MAG 63INT
Bolt, Star Punch, Flash, Happy Dance, Wind, Cure;
Physical; unknown(0); unknown(0); Wind; unknown(0);
Elemental Air

Source code:
Code:
/* we begin in php mode */

echo 'php test ok!<br>';

if(!$_POST['d3-preview']) return;

echo 'preview ok!<br>';

$importing = &$_POST['import-input'];

if(!$importing ) return; else echo 'importing...<br>'; //, $importing, '<br><br>';

define("UNKNOWN",0);
define("PERSONA",1);
define("DEMON",2);
define("SKILL",3);
define("ITEM",4);
define("TYPE",5);

class Synonym
{
 var $name = 'unknown';
 var $mip_name = '知りない';
 var $rev_name = 'missing';
 var $function = 0;
 var $notes = NULL;
 var $more = 0;
}

$Synonyms = array();

$Synonym[0] = new Synonym; //Null Synonym

$Lookups = array(0=>0,""=>0,"unknown"=>0,"知りない"=>0);

$s = 0; //Synonym counter

function Lookup($f,$Name,$MIP=NULL,$Rev=NULL,$Notes="generated!")
{
  if(!$Name&&!$MIP&&!$Rev) return 0; //hack?

  if(is_null($MIP)&&!is_null($Name))   
  {
   $Name = ltrim($Name); if($Name[0]>'z') //...
   {
    $MIP = $Name; $Name = NULL; //hack: assuming Japanese
   }
  }
 
  if(is_null($Rev)&&!is_null($Name))
  {
   $Rev = $Name; $Name = NULL; //hack: assuming Revelations
  }

  if(is_string($f))
  {
   switch(strtolower(trim($f)))
   {
   default: $f = UNKNOWN;
   
   case "persona": $f = PERSONA; break;
   case "demon": $f = DEMON; break;
   case "skill": $f = SKILL; break;
   case "item": $f = ITEM; break;
   case "type": $f = TYPE; break;
   }
  }
  else if($f>5) $f = UNKNOWN; //hack

  global $Synonyms, $Lookups, $s;
 
  $S = NULL; $out = $Lookups[$Name];
   
  if(is_null($out)) //add synonym
  {
   if(!$S) $S = $Synonyms[$out=++$s] = new Synonym();
   
   $Lookups[$S->name=trim($Name)] = $s;
  }
  else if($out) $S = $Synonyms[$out];
 
  $mip = $Lookups[$MIP?$MIP:NULL];
 
  if(is_null($mip)) //add synonym
  {
   if(!$S) $S = $Synonyms[$out=++$s] = new Synonym();
   
   $Lookups[$S->mip_name=trim($MIP)] = $s;
  }
  else if($mip)
  {
   if(!$S) $S = $Synonyms[$out=$mip];
     
   $S->mip_name = trim($MIP); //danger: overwriting   
  }
   
  $rev = $Lookups[$Rev?$Rev:NULL];
   
  if(is_null($rev)) //add synonym
  {       
   if(!$S) $S = $Synonyms[$out=++$s] = new Synonym();
   
   $Lookups[$S->rev_name=trim($Rev)] = $s;
  }
  else if($rev)
  {
   if(!$S) $S = $Synonyms[$out=$rev];
     
   $S->rev_name = trim($Rev); //danger: overwriting
  }
 
  if(!$S) return $out; //out probably zero
 
  $S->function = $f; //danger: overwriting
       
  if($Notes)
 
   if(!$S->notes) $S->notes = $Notes;
   
    else $S->notes.=" ".$Notes;
 
  return $out;
}

class Persona
{
 var $synonym = 0;

 var $lvl = 0;
 var $name = 'unknown';
 var $mip_name = '知りない';
 var $rev_name = 'missing';
 var $arcana = 22; //lookup
 var $sp = 0;
 var $pattern = 0; //lookup
 var $compat = NULL; //lookup array
 var $recipe = NULL; //lookup array
 var $return = 0; //lookup
 var $str = 0;
 var $vit = 0;
 var $tec = 0;
 var $agl = 0;
 var $luc = 0;
 var $mag = 0;
 var $int = 0;
 var $skills = NULL; //lookup array
 var $weak = NULL; //lookup array
 var $resist = NULL; //lookup array
 var $immune = NULL; //lookup array
 var $reflect = NULL; //lookup array
 var $drain = NULL; //lookup array
 var $typeA = 0; //lookup
 var $typeB = 0; //lookup
 var $story = "";
}

$Personae = array();

$Personae[0] = new Persona; //Null Persona

$lines = explode("\r\n",$importing); //hack??

$rows = sizeof($lines);

echo 'found ', $rows, ' rows... <br>';

for($r=0,$p=0;$r<$rows;$r++)
{
 $row = &$lines[$r];

 $mode = $row[0];

 if($mode=='$') //a synonym line
 {
  $in  = explode(",",$row); $cols = sizeof($stats);
   
  Lookup($in[11],$in[3],$in[7],$in[1],$in[21]);
 
 }
 else if($mode>='0'&&$mode<='9') //a persona line
 {
//printf("%04d %s <br>",$r,$row);

  $P = $Personae[++$p] = new Persona();
 
  $stats  = explode(",",$row); $cols = sizeof($stats);
   
  for($c=0;$c<$cols;$c++) switch($c)
  {
  case 0: $P->lvl = (integer)$stats[0]; break;
  case 1: $P->name = trim($stats[1]); break;
  case 2: $P->mip_name = trim($stats[2]); break;
  case 3: $P->rev_name = trim($stats[3]); break;
  case 4: $P->arcana = (integer)$stats[4]; break;
  case 5: $P->sp = (integer)$stats[5]; break;
  case 6: $P->pattern = Lookup(TYPE,$stats[6]); break;
  case 7: $P->compat = array();
  {
   $list  = explode(";",$stats[7]); $n = sizeof($list);
   
   for($i=0;$i<$n;$i++) $P->compat[] = Lookup(TYPE,$list[$i]); break;
  }
  case 8: $P->recipe = array();
  { 
   $list  = explode(";",$stats[8]); $n = sizeof($list);
   
   if($n) $P->recipe[0] = Lookup(ITEM,$list[0]);
   
   for($i=1;$i<$n;$i++) $P->recipe[] = Lookup(DEMON,$list[$i]); break;
  }
  case 9: $P->return = Lookup(ITEM,$stats[9]); break;
 
  case 10: $P->str = $stats[10]; break; 
  case 11: $P->vit = $stats[11]; break;
  case 12: $P->tec = $stats[12]; break;
  case 13: $P->agl = $stats[13]; break;
  case 14: $P->luc = $stats[14]; break;
  case 15: $P->mag = $stats[15]; break;
  case 16: $P->int = $stats[16]; break;
 
  case 17: $P->skills = array();
  {
    $skills = explode(";",$stats[17]);
           
    for($i=0,$n = sizeof($skills);$i<$n;$i++)
   
     $P->skills[] = Lookup(SKILL,$skills[$i]); break;
  }
  case 18: case 19: case 20:
  case 21: case 22: case 23:
  {
   if($stats[$c]&&$stats[$c][0])
   
    $P->skills[] = Lookup(SKILL,$stats[$c]); break;     
  }
  case 24: $P->weak = array();
  {
    $types = explode(";",$stats[24]);
           
    for($i=0,$n = sizeof($types);$i<$n;$i++)
   
     $P->weak[] = Lookup(TYPE,$types[$i]); break;
  }
  case 25: $P->resist = array();
  {
    $types = explode(";",$stats[25]);
           
    for($i=0,$n = sizeof($types);$i<$n;$i++)
   
     $P->resist[] = Lookup(TYPE,$types[$i]); break;
  }
  case 26: $P->immune = array();
  {
    $types = explode(";",$stats[26]);
           
    for($i=0,$n = sizeof($types);$i<$n;$i++)
   
     $P->immune[] = Lookup(TYPE,$types[$i]); break;
  }
  case 27: $P->reflect = array();
  {
    $types = explode(";",$stats[27]);
           
    for($i=0,$n = sizeof($types);$i<$n;$i++)
   
     $P->reflect[] = Lookup(TYPE,$types[$i]); break;
  }
  case 28: $P->drain = array();
  {
    $types = explode(";",$stats[28]);
           
    for($i=0,$n = sizeof($types);$i<$n;$i++)
   
     $P->drain[] = Lookup(TYPE,$types[$i]); break;
  }
  case 29:
  {
    $types = explode(";",$stats[29]);
   
    if(sizeof($types)<2) continue;
             
    $P->typeA = Lookup(TYPE,$types[0]);
    $P->typeB = Lookup(TYPE,$types[1]);
               
    break;
  } 
  default: $c = $cols; //finish
  }   
   
  $P->synonym = Lookup(PERSONA,$P->name,$P->mip_name,$P->rev_name);   
 }
 else if($mode=='!') //a description line
 {
  if(!$p) continue; //no Persona exist yet

  for($i=1;$row[$i]&&$row[$i]!=',';$i++);
 
  if($row[$i]) $Personae[$p]->story.=substr($row,++$i);
 }
 else continue;
}

echo $s, ' Synonyms imported... <br>';

$Functions = array
(
"UNKNOWN","PERSONA", "DEMON", "SKILL", "ITEM", "TYPE"
);

for($i=1;$i<=$s;$i++)
{
 $S = $Synonyms[$i];

 echo $Functions[$S->function<6?$S->function:0], ' ';
 
 echo $S->name, '<br>', $S->mip_name, ' / ', $S->rev_name, '<br>&nbsp;', $S->notes,'<br>';
}

echo $p, ' Personae imported... <br>';

$Tarot = array
(
"0", "The ", "Fool",
"I", "The ", "Magician",
"II", "The High", "Priestess",
"III", "The ", "Empress",
"IV", "The ", "Emperor",
"V", "The ", "Hierophant",
"VI", "The ", "Lovers",
"VII", "The ", "Chariot",
"VIII", "The ", "Strength",
"IX", "The ", "Hermit",
"X", "The Wheel of", "Fortune",
"XI", "", "Justice",
"XII", "The ", "Hanged Man",
"XIII", "", "Death",
"XIV", "", "Temperance",
"XV", "The ", "Devil",
"XVI", "The ", "Tower",
"XVII", "The ", "Star",
"XVIII", "The ", "Moon",
"XIX", "The ", "Sun",
"XX", "", "Judgment",
"XXI", "The ", "World",
"?", "The", "Null"
);

function Synonym($s)
{
 global $Synonyms, $Lookups;
 
 $S = $Synonyms[$s];
 
 if($Lookups[$S->name]) return $S->name;
 
 if($Lookups[$S->mip_name]) return $S->mip_name;
 if($Lookups[$S->rev_name]) return $S->rev_name;
 
 return 'unknown('. $s .')';
}

for($i=1;$i<=$p;$i++)
{
 $P = $Personae[$i];

 echo $Tarot[$P->arcana%23*3+2], ' ', $P->name, '<br>', $P->mip_name, ' / ', $P->rev_name, '<br>&nbsp;', $P->story,'<br>';
 
 echo Synonym($P->pattern), '; ';
 
 for($ii=sizeof($P->compat);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->compat[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':'; ';
 
 for($ii=sizeof($P->recipe);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->recipe[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':'; ';
 
 echo Synonym($P->return), '<br>';
 
 echo $P->str, 'STR ', $P->vit, 'VIT ', $P->tec, 'TEC ',
      $P->agl, 'AGL ', $P->luc, 'LUC ', $P->mag, 'MAG ',
      $P->int, 'INT <br>';
     
 for($ii=sizeof($P->skills);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->skills[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':';<br>'; 
 
 for($ii=sizeof($P->weak);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->weak[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':'; ';
 
 for($ii=sizeof($P->resist);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->resist[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':'; ';
 
 for($ii=sizeof($P->immune);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->immune[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':'; ';
 
 for($ii=sizeof($P->reflect);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->reflect[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':'; ';
 
 for($ii=sizeof($P->drain);$ii;$ii--)
 
  echo Synonym($P->drain[$ii-1]), $ii>1?', ':';<br>';
 
 echo Synonym($P->typeA), ' ', Synonym($P->typeB), '<br>';       
}

/* we should end in php mode */


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 02, 2008, 04:43:36 AM
All I can say for now, is the database is technically working as planned...

The key word is technically... from now on it's just a question of presentation :smokin:

There is still nothing to see on the page linked above however :goodnight:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 02, 2008, 04:46:37 PM
There is something up now at:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/demonary/velvet-room/persona/

The database is very small so far, but the links don't go anywhere atm anyway. I will try to add basic sorting options asap, but mostly I'd like to work on the full info popups.

I would setup a P2:Batsu database in the meantime, but we don't even have a P2 info section yet, so there would be nowhere to link to it from really. I will still do that asap anyway, just less of a priority for now...



Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 02, 2008, 04:49:46 PM
Looks good so far. And that's the reason why you want them by level :smokin: I hope I can get my hands with the P1 Demonary asap, but I have too much work in here :sick:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 02, 2008, 06:32:57 PM
I prefer the spreadsheet be in order by level. The page itself is just a demo however. It will be sortable and able to display any information desired in time... but the default will likely be by level.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 03, 2008, 03:59:28 PM
Once you start filling in the P1 database, I will translate the names into the English columns (you can also just insert these translations http://www.sumarucity.com/megami/wiki/index.php?title=Persona_Name_Changes if you want, but I'll double check them each)

The translated names will be the names of the image files. So I'll also need you (or someone) to make an archive file (compressed directory) will all the card graphics as individual files (lossless gif or png is best -- make sure they look just like the bmp file) which should all have the same name as the English column on the spreadsheet.

I'm going to have to hack the slimbox/lightbox setup to show pages instead of images. Hopefully that will work out ok. In the meantime I'll probably just have the links go to a black background page.



Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 03, 2008, 06:41:43 PM
Ok, got it! I'm not so sure, but I guess I have the tarot images for P1, I'll look for them in all the backups I've made until now :sweatdrop:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 04, 2008, 01:25:30 PM
There, the demonary (only Personas) of Persona1 is like 75% completed. :biggrin: I just need to add the Japanese names, items, etc.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 04, 2008, 03:49:34 PM
Awesome, I'll try to take care of the names today... or as many as I can. Thanks for being a trooper :hearton:

If these ads ever start pulling some weight you'll be sure to get a hefty cut. So far however there hasn't been a ton of clicking going on. Some clicks are worth at least 44cents USD, at most 88cents... many ads are worth nothing or at least 3cents (the no cents ones are public service announcements most likely -- which seem to receive more than half our clicks actually)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 04, 2008, 05:15:49 PM
Awesome, I'll try to take care of the names today... or as many as I can. Thanks for being a trooper :hearton:

Don't worry! It's good to be of help around here! :firstmate:  I will begin to gather all the info I need to begin working with the demonary of Soul Hacker and also I'll look for the tarot images of P1, so I'll let you know about it.  :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 04, 2008, 05:46:00 PM
Your going to have to correct a few things...

We need the numbers first in the Arcana column. The names don't actually do anything. Otherwise all the Persona are Fools:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/demonary/velvet-room/persona/?presentation=Revelations&d3-perform=Perusona!

The Japanese you copied into the Non-Compat column is unfortunately just the type of the return item. We don't actually need that info in any columns. Try to match up the info I put in the first few columns with the Fool-est page. These are the skill affinities the Persona can't inherit under any circumstances.

The return items for Revelations should be in the gamefaqs page listed, but I'm not positive they are all there. If not you can use the Japanese items on the Fool-est page. They are the column with 閻魔帳 at the top.


It's not a huge deal now. But the Synonym listing section will eventually have to be filled in as well. This spreadsheet will actually be the master database which other databases (demons, spells, items) will use to synchronize themselves eventually -- in accordance with relational database theory.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 04, 2008, 05:50:13 PM
Ok, I'll take a look at it tomorrow! For now, let me rest 'cuase this thing is exhausting!  :goodnight:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 05, 2008, 09:43:10 AM
Ok, the Arcana column has their own respective number and I typed the correct spells for the "Non-Compat" column. I guess you must do something with the configuration cause I don't think the demonary will update automatically by adding new stuff to the spreadsheet.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 05, 2008, 02:19:25 PM
Great! But one last detail... we're gonna need you to change lines like:

Quote
破魔・祝福・奇跡

into....

Quote
破魔; 祝福; 奇跡

Also the Recipe column is still empty... it is very important. But no big rush. Keep it up...


PS: Oh yes, I'm kinda got the lightbox style popups working, but there are still some kinks to work out, and the question of what to put in them (all info of course, but how??)

Getting a page to load in the lightbox box was an all evening programming job, as is a lot of stuff I do for the website. I don't mind so much as I'm learning state-of-the-art internet technologies along the way.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 05, 2008, 03:39:40 PM
Great! But one last detail... we're gonna need you to change lines like:

Quote
破魔・祝福・奇跡

into....

Quote
破魔; 祝福; 奇跡

Ok, I'll take care of that asap.

Also the Recipe column is still empty... it is very important. But no big rush. Keep it up...

I'll keep it in mind, but I'll be working on the semicolon thing for now, so this will have to wait.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 05, 2008, 11:54:32 PM
I have a system in place for graphics. Basically the Persona's graphic file should be the same as the "English" name, that is the unofficial translation. Except odd accented letters should be replaced with whatever letter from the alphabet they look most like, and spaces and apostrophes should be replaced with dashes, ie. Shōmen-kongō becomes Shomen-kongo, and Cú Chulaind becomes Cu-Chulaind. The file type is less important, whatever you have is fine, but they should all be the same. Eventually I'd like .png files however.

The popup system is working on supported browsers (edited: well IE is lagging behind as usual) ...but I haven't worked out the all info page yet. I still have to finish translating many of the names, and eventually all of the spells, items, and affinities, etcetera will have to be translated. Truthfully someone else is going to have to do the bulk of translation in the future, I just can't do it all... I can really only check it for accuracy once fully sourced.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 06, 2008, 01:01:46 AM
Wow, it looks cool. I can bet you that once it has images and all the info in place, that thing will look just awesome!! :aroused:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 06, 2008, 04:36:17 AM
I think there shouldn't be any load time between Personae in the popup unless you click too fast... I should probably monkey with the code a little more.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 07, 2008, 03:54:20 AM
After hours of programming here is a screenshot so far...

PS: You can change between three translation versions by clicking on the top right text area :smokin:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 07, 2008, 02:44:53 PM
I think I've successfully removed the loading time, but there is still a considerable pause while changing images with firefox, and other browsers have some quirks.

If someone can find a copy of the Revelations: Persona loading screen I might try using it for transitions.


In the meantime I guess we need those sheets of sprites you had before Emilio. I have a set but I auto-contrasted them all so I could see them better :tongue:


You could start renaming one set to the English names used by the database as we discussed. Just add _bg at the end of the name (and before the file extension)

I have the cards. I'm not sure what to do with them yet, but you could go ahead and rename a set of those to save us that trouble. Also we need them double sized with no resampling (nearest neighbor upscale) if you want to do that. Try to get the names as close as possible, but I'll check each one / correct if necessary eventually. Also I'm calling the double sized cards _2x instead of _bg. We will probably filter the cards a bit to make them easier to make out.

I'll try to translate some more names today, but if I don't have them done just yet, just keep the original ripped file names so you can easily see which ones are unchanged.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 07, 2008, 07:57:31 PM
Ok, here they are:

Personas from MIP:
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?amgn5u9nmnh

Demons, Personas and Charas from MIP:
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?2wv2xmn0uqm

and if you find them useful for now, the spell charts:
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?2v2o2tkd3mv

I'll get you the LOADING screen of MIP asap.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 07, 2008, 09:21:29 PM
FYI: I downloaded the first link, but it was just the character's face shots :sweatdrop:

Basically we need someone to use these to make a different version of the Persona archive only with the file names changed to match the archive names (the unofficial translation names)

I also started filling in the synonym rows in the MIP table. I can't do the rest of it, but if someone fills the rest in feel free to leave the "English" column empty and I'll fill it in behind you. Classic Megaten terms go in the second section. Hopefully that way we can easily copy them over to other databases.

If we don't do this^ then basically most of the info fields in the popup will show up with dummy replacements most of the time :frown:

edited: Oh yes, found this page: http://kawanagi.hp.infoseek.co.jp/per1/per1-per.html

I also added it to the spreadsheet links.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 07, 2008, 09:33:16 PM
Some images that would look cool as a gif for a "Now Loading" screen if it is possible to use a gif for something like that (others are just random images I extract from the game). If you find them useful then be my guest and have them. :wink:

(http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/3143/str00130001wn0.png)(http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1210/str10960001dc6.png)

(http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/2985/str18570001cq8.png)(http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/3518/str18640001vx5.png)

(http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/1006/str19260001lw2.png)(http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/5017/str23440001vw6.png)

And, damn! I didn't knew that the "Now Loading" screen was only available at "Revelations Persona" and was not at MIP @@

(http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/8411/str24000001hx7.png)

Basically we need someone to use these to make a different version of the Persona archive only with the file names changed to match the archive names (the unofficial translation names)

That sounds like a lot of work! :eek: (not THAT much but...) we seriously need some help in here.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 08, 2008, 01:47:20 AM
Yes, we could all use some help :smug:

Just imagine all the poor souls toiling away at gamefaqs guides.... we can at least manage as much I think :smokin:

Btw, is that the full resolution of the loading screen?


PS: Also I'll be away for a few days this week sometime... I'm back on the train again heading back to life as usual.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 08, 2008, 01:55:48 AM
Another cool website: http://www10.plala.or.jp/g-labo/dds/megaten_top.htm


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 08, 2008, 05:07:57 AM
I added the basic stats -- and I'm not sure if those numbers are after or before ranking up :sweatdrop:

I also added some noise to the card which made it look a lot crisper at double size I think. It's still jaggy around the edge however. God's speed to whoever ends up doctoring these cards :smokin:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 08, 2008, 09:18:43 AM
Btw, is that the full resolution of the loading screen?

I ripped the image from the game data, so I guess that's the full resolution, I didn't capture the screen while playing or something like that.

I added the basic stats -- and I'm not sure if those numbers are after or before ranking up :sweatdrop:

Looks really cool! :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 09, 2008, 01:24:22 AM
You really need to make a Sea of Souls thread Emilio. We need you to keep track of the stuff you do for the website. It makes it easier for me to credit you karma as well :rolleyes:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 09, 2008, 04:01:59 PM
It's finally there! :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 09, 2008, 09:35:21 PM
Cool....

Gave you some karma for all your data entry work so far. I know it's probably not enough, but I don't want to make a habit of granting more than one karma at a time :sweatdrop:


Well I missed my train... so I guess I don't have a whole lot to do until same time tomorrow, so I might as well try to translate some more stuff in the database spreadsheet in the meantime (if I don't get distracted by something)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 09, 2008, 09:43:00 PM
Btw, I don't want you to start another database spreadsheet until we have the section titled:

Stock Synonyms Table (synonyms common to most Megaten titles)  *sorted by the romanji column*

More or less fully filled in. I asked DevilRy to take a stab at it, but it would be awesome if everyone would add anything they can think of to this section asap.

The reason it is important to future databases, is this section should be the first thing added to a new spreadsheet, and for that reason will determine the basic column layout of the new database. Since most of this information will be shared by every game, it will save a lot of work to simply copy it (from whatever game is most similar)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 09, 2008, 09:48:27 PM
Cool....

Gave you some karma for all your data entry work so far. I know it's probably not enough, but I don't want to make a habit of granting more than one karma at a time :sweatdrop:

Thanks, and don't worry about the whole karma stuff. I laugh a lot with the "for mucho trabajo"  :xd:

Btw, I don't want you to start another database spreadsheet until we have the section titled:

Ok, got it! Once I have enough time, I'll began sorting the Persona2 Demonary.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 10, 2008, 12:46:26 AM
I dunno, we don't actually have to finish this section before you can start on another -- just as long as you copy the Synonym sections over and design the new database to work with it.

I would prefer we kinda flesh out a database before moving onto others however.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 14, 2008, 08:16:33 AM
I added skills to the Persona popups. Next I will need to make them change per presentation mode.

More importantly it half way proves the scheme I cooked up for encoding lists of terms in a single database cell. I'm still not sure how it will work in reverse, probably ok (reverse would be for instance looking up Personae with a particular skill or whatever)

For some reason it's a pain in the ass to store multiple values in a database (without making a new database!!)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 15, 2008, 05:00:43 AM
I added an "advanced options" system to the Velvet Room page:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/demonary/velvet-room/persona/

The options themselves are pretty simple so far... but the system is in place at least!!

I've also dropped the Kali graphics, so the Persona gallery uses whatever graphics are available or nothing now. I uploaded a few backgrounds for some of the ones I could recognize off the top of my head.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 16, 2008, 05:06:23 AM
I added a number of cool stuff to the popups... most of the stats visible from the in-game analyze screen.

edited: http://www.digitaldevildb.com/demonary/velvet-room/persona/lightbox/?presentation=English&persona=468

The typography tends to come out quite different on Firefox and Google Chrome (even though these two are generally very similar)

Eventually I'm going to use absolute coordinates based on font proportions. Should look much more consistent and scale better (lightbox and all)

PS: If anyone can find me a screenshot of the Revelations Persona analyze screen that would be useful (it spans more than one screen btw)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 17, 2008, 07:44:21 AM
I've been up for 29hrs and I haven't felt tired all day long :confused:

Just been doing odd stuff... including this just now:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/demonary/velvet-room/persona/lightbox/?presentation=English&persona=13

Good news, translation between releases is in place... bad news, until someone fills in the spreadsheet the values will continue to be unknowable.

I'm sorry, but I'm not doing the data entry. I'll help with translation eventually, but I'm still working towards finishing the Persona names :redface:

edited: btw, you presently need a Meiryo font installed to view the japanese correctly. Meiryo is the Vista Japanese font of choice afaik.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: DevilRy on December 17, 2008, 03:56:22 PM
On my sister's monitor the stats are clipped on the bottom when you open it up with the slimbox from the demonary page.

What happened to the Tarot Cards btw?  I guess I could resize them all but you'd have to give me a place to upload them to unless you want them stored on photobucket.  I feel like I definitely don't know enough about spreadsheets to be entirely useful, but I could probably help out at least in the graphics department. 


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 17, 2008, 06:54:26 PM
On my sister's monitor the stats are clipped on the bottom when you open it up with the slimbox from the demonary page.

What happened to the Tarot Cards btw?  I guess I could resize them all but you'd have to give me a place to upload them to unless you want them stored on photobucket.  I feel like I definitely don't know enough about spreadsheets to be entirely useful, but I could probably help out at least in the graphics department. 

I'm not sure why it would be clipping. I guess I need to setup a Firefox2 install somewhere regardless. I'm going to completely overhaul the was the typography is generated sometime soon.

There never really were Tarot cards, just hte Kali one I mocked up. I'm not sure what to do with them at this point. I'm leaning towards just using the normal ones (small size) and eventually if someone resizes them have a double size popup showup when the mouse is over the small version. Not sure about positioning yet. It's likely there will be more than one page of information (probably it'll scroll down like in the game)

Now that I've setup a simple arcana based sort on the db page, I'm going to use that to finish renaming the background images. If you wanna help with graphics for a db. The way to do it is to just make a folder with all the graphics, and when you're finished zip them, then put the file somewhere I can download it. Sorry, but that's the best I can come up with for a while. It's probably the best way to go anyhow, unless google has an documents archive type thing similar to the spreadsheet app.

If you really wanna help with the db though, the absolute best thing you could do now is play with the spreadsheet, and add all the standard megaten skills to the second synonym area, agi, bufu, etcetera. They're sorted by romanji, so you don't have to worry about tracking down the Revelations parallel for now (someone else can do that anyway) ...if you wanna do that the last suggested link goes to a page with all the japanese magic in the game (though ordered by Persona -- perhaps you could find a better link)

Once the backgrounds are up and most of the Japanese/English skill names are in place, I'll make the Velvet room area easier to find for browsers.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 17, 2008, 06:59:00 PM
Oh, the skills that are unique to MIP go in the top synonym table which is sorted by Revelations titles. What to do with spells like Garu/Gal is discretionary at this point. If they appear in both areas, it shouldn't be a big deal. Priority goes to the first appearance of the term.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 17, 2008, 09:30:56 PM
Freyr (Furei Frey = Flare) seems to be missing from your animation sprite catalogue (the card is there)

I'll let you know if I find any more holes (I've just started / am working thru the Magicians)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 18, 2008, 09:13:26 AM
Freyr (Furei Frey = Flare) seems to be missing from your animation sprite catalogue (the card is there)

I'll let you know if I find any more holes (I've just started / am working thru the Magicians)

The same happens with some characters pictures (at least in the collection of P2 Batsu), I guess the software I use to ripp the images from the CD is not capable of extract ALL the images and sometimes it displays a lot of repeated images.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 18, 2008, 11:39:08 AM
Freyr (Furei Frey = Flare) seems to be missing from your animation sprite catalogue (the card is there)

I'll let you know if I find any more holes (I've just started / am working thru the Magicians)

The same happens with some characters pictures (at least in the collection of P2 Batsu), I guess the software I use to ripp the images from the CD is not capable of extract ALL the images and sometimes it displays a lot of repeated images.

Well we'll need them all, so figure it out please :hearton:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 18, 2008, 07:21:27 PM
Freyr (Furei Frey = Flare) seems to be missing from your animation sprite catalogue (the card is there)

I'll let you know if I find any more holes (I've just started / am working thru the Magicians)

The same happens with some characters pictures (at least in the collection of P2 Batsu), I guess the software I use to ripp the images from the CD is not capable of extract ALL the images and sometimes it displays a lot of repeated images.


Well we'll need them all, so figure it out please :hearton:

I'll see what I can do, but I don't promise you anything, like I told you, the software is not capable of extract ALL the images. But let's see what  happens now. :geno:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 19, 2008, 01:51:08 AM
No offense, but it's up to you to figure it out. You've come this far, what's the point of maintaining the rips if they're not complete?? Jump on the internet and do your research. Find the sprites manually if you gotta :rainbow:

newtopic: Btw, is there a name for the two Personae used by bosses? We have the sprites, but no info. At least I'd like to know the name of the character's that used them, and their arcana if at all possible. It's too bad you couldn't obtain these Personae. I wonder if you could with a gameshark (wouldn't be surprised)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 19, 2008, 11:30:41 AM
No offense, but it's up to you to figure it out. You've come this far, what's the point of maintaining the rips if they're not complete?? Jump on the internet and do your research. Find the sprites manually if you gotta :rainbow:

I'm doing what I can, I already did a lot with providing the whole sprites for the spells, Personas, demons, characters, etc. It's not my fault that the software doesn't display all the images, and right now I don't have time to sit and search for the 1 or 2 missing spell sprites in the net.

If you know of a software to ripp images from games, then let me know, but for now I can't spend the whole morning searching for a single image.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 19, 2008, 12:02:06 PM
I haven't tried to do anything like that for Aeons.

As much as we appreciate the sprites, we can't really get away with using an incomplete set too easily.

We need Freyr's Persona animation sprite (not just a spell sprite)

That is pretty important in my book.


If you know how to comb the sprites, then tell us how so someone can find him...


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 19, 2008, 01:47:26 PM
If you know how to comb the sprites, then tell us how so someone can find him...

"Combine"? Sorry, I don't understand "comb".

Anyway, If you want I can redo the image search once again, maybe I didn't save that specific sprite you're asking for.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 19, 2008, 05:00:38 PM
Comb just means like combing your hair, only not :aroused:

Just do whatever you can do, and then do some more if you don't mind :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 19, 2008, 07:08:20 PM
Comb just means like combing your hair, only not :aroused:

Just do whatever you can do, and then do some more if you don't mind :wink:

Ok, I'll see what I can do :wink:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 19, 2008, 09:51:06 PM
This time I did something a little bit different, I save ALL the images that the software displayed, not just the spell sprites, one by one or something like that, but in response to that I have a folder of 104 MB approximately, you will find A LOT of repeated images in there but maybe you'll end up finding the image you're looking for.

Give me a little bit of time, because I will upload the folder as a 2 or 3 parts file, once I finish uploading it, I'll post the link.  :smug:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 20, 2008, 12:49:35 AM
why don't you try combing thru it. Freyr is the Persona in the Red toga outfit holding a tree branch or something. At any rate, I have the card from your stuff, but not the animation sprites.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 20, 2008, 01:31:42 AM
I've been driving myself completely insane trying to match this persona up with any conceivable known figure:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/demonary/velvet-room/persona/lightbox/?presentation=English&persona=147

I swear if such a thing exists, it is undocumented on the internet. The only loose lead is this entry here:

Quote from: http://www10.plala.or.jp/g-labo/dds/dict/juzoku.htm
フウタイ(Futai)  出身地:中国
 風泰。河南省にある首陽山に住むと伝えられる吉祥神。虎の尾を持った人の姿をしており、天地を動かし暴風雨を起こす能力を持つ

But best I can figure is this is pure bullshit. If such a description exists in some old chinese book, it isn't yet on the internet. There are similar concepts in Thai Himmapan mythology... the Rajasri (lions) and there is even a Liger, but the stuff doesn't match this guy conceptually at all.

The only remaining lead is really my first guess... based on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Tigers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Duties_Unit
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/SDU

These guys are known in Japan as the Feifuutai, based on the Chinese Fei Hu (flying tiger) + Japanese Tai (force) ...and it's funny if you just clip it to FuuTai, you get the contraction from Fuuraingu Taigazu (the Japanese never let a good contraction go to waste)

The Persona looks like a tiger, jumps around, even double jumping around invisible walls, and seems to be wearing more modern pants which happen to appear identical to the ones on teh Honk Kong home page:

http://www.specialoperations.com/Foreign/Hong_Kong/Default.htm

It's hard to draw a conclusion... but it seems as close as anything. So I'm basically wondering if this is enough to translate the Persona's name as Flying Tiger? Or perhaps more artfully as Fei Hu? (fitting alongside Bai Hu I suppose)

I found some Japanese chat pages with people wondering what the hell the persona could be. But that's about it.

If I can't find an official identity for it, I'm tempted to call it futai in quotes, or just leave it officially as unknown.

Fei Hu seems acceptable to me, otherwise all my sleuthing about is for not :crying:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 20, 2008, 08:04:41 AM
Is this the one?

(http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/6066/str0733ke4.png)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 20, 2008, 01:58:10 PM
Yeah, looks like it :hearton:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 22, 2008, 10:56:44 AM
The database is here for now:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/construction/persona/

There is now a new top level page called "Under Construction" where interesting but incomplete pages like this can be found.


I have all the names translated save fore the Fools, which I'll probably do today sometime. We can try to work out some sort of graphics uploading system now that the names are all known.

I will probably next focus on making the Popup switch personae quicker. For some reason it's really slow, even though it's not generally downloading anything. There is probably definitely a way to make it move faster. Unfortunately at the moment it's a bit more of a burden to use than it is nifty.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 22, 2008, 04:04:25 PM
On my sister's monitor the stats are clipped on the bottom when you open it up with the slimbox from the demonary page.

What happened to the Tarot Cards btw?  I guess I could resize them all but you'd have to give me a place to upload them to unless you want them stored on photobucket.  I feel like I definitely don't know enough about spreadsheets to be entirely useful, but I could probably help out at least in the graphics department. 


I see what you mean now... FF2 is kicking the left side way down in the middle of the screen (not so much cutting it off) for no reason.... I'll have to figure out what the hell it's thinking. Most likely there is a typo in the html somewhere.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 22, 2008, 04:51:57 PM
^Ok, fixed... I guess what it was is the older browsers though recognizing divs of partial width, still won't allow them to float to the left or right independently (because the concept of a div intrinsically implies (or did) a vertical divide. I could've changed the divs to tables, but I went ahead and divided everything into two halves, which is a good damage minification measure just in case one side started pushing into the other.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 25, 2008, 08:41:42 AM
It took me what seemed like a few hours on xmas eve to work it all out... but I happy to announce the Persona popups should now be nearly instantaneous while browsing (depending on your connection speed)

I also fixed a caching bug that would make you sometimes end up on the wrong Persona if you left the popup then opened another.

Lucifer (the last Persona) is broken now popup wise, but I'll have to look into that another day....

There are still a number of interface conveniences I'd like to program in just as soon as I can get around to it.


It's setup to start pre-loading the next Persona asap. So you're more likely to see a loading screen if you try to click thru fast. That should still be up to your connection speed. I'm not positive but it seems like the background/images don't start loading until they're visible. That is logical, but I'll have to see if you can't force them to do otherwise. Also there needs to be a way to manually refresh the Persona info from the popup screen if possible. And there are other more involved prefetching strategies that would speed up browsing.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 29, 2008, 08:42:11 AM
I hate to say it Emilio, but I'm gonna need you to make all the spells in the Persona spreadsheet match the spell names on this page:

http://www.sumarucity.com/megami/wiki/index.php?title=Persona_Name_Changes#Fire

I looked into it, and those names are the correct ones. I'm sorry there are so many different translations on the internet that don't respect the actual names. It isn't just a matter of correctness, but it won't work if the names are wrong (inconsistent)

You can see the actual spell names in these pages:

http://terror.snm-hgkz.ch/mirrors/thegia/sites/www.thegia.com/psx/pers/persmedia3a.html

As you can see, basically there are no spaces ever. And Abbreviated names look like MAGUp, DEFDrop, POWReturn, etcetera.

I got frustrated with no one working on the terminology spreadsheet, which is when I noticed. I went ahead and started filling it in:

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=piKSlpkg0llAny-VoXNRkKQ&hl=en

Others could do this however. It would make more sense if I spent my time doing stuff others can't :doh:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on December 31, 2008, 06:48:01 AM
Can I count on you to take the spaces out of the skill names Emilio? It's very important :ninja:

You could try exporting to .xls, then import it back as a new spreadsheet (to make sure nothing is lost)

If you could isolate those columns, you'd just have to replace all spaces with no spaces, then replace semicolons with a semicolon and a space.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on December 31, 2008, 10:57:34 AM
Can I count on you to take the spaces out of the skill names Emilio? It's very important :ninja:

Yeah! of course! Just give me some time, maybe tomorrow I'll start correcting the names. I will play P4 in a while :cheesy:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on January 02, 2009, 03:06:31 AM
Tony had some somewhat detailed writings for the following Devils...

47     Ashinaga     Tanega     Japanese Legend           138     [BLOB - 491 B]    [BLOB - 330 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 272 B]
   Edit    Delete    36    Hannya         Japanese Mythology              [BLOB - 371 B]    [BLOB - 197 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 249 B]
   Edit    Delete    37    Ihika         Japanese Shinto Mythology              [BLOB - 456 B]    [BLOB - 218 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 100 B]
   Edit    Delete    19    Agathion         Unknown         134    [BLOB - 161 B]    [BLOB - 130 B]    [BLOB - 7 B]    [BLOB - 61 B]
   Edit    Delete    38    Hag    Old Hag, Crone    British Folklore              [BLOB - 956 B]    [BLOB - 193 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 109 B]
   Edit    Delete    48    Acheri         Indian Folklore         142    [BLOB - 308 B]    [BLOB - 211 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 69 B]
   Edit    Delete    45    Agony         Christianity         136    [BLOB - 495 B]    [BLOB - 264 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 54 B]
   Edit    Delete    46    Aka-Mant    Acamas, Akamant, Akamas    Greek Mythology         135    [BLOB - 863 B]    [BLOB - 323 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 59 B]
   Edit    Delete    26    Alp    Alp Vampire    German Folklore    Succubus         [BLOB - 1.0   KiB]    [BLOB - 154 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 188 B]
   Edit    Delete    56    Apsaras    AccharÄ�    Hindu and Buddhist Mythology    Lord Brahma, Gandharva    148    [BLOB - 1.3   KiB]    [BLOB - 210 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 166 B]
   Edit    Delete    30    Pyro Jack    Jack Lantern, Jack o' Lantern    Irish Folklore         217    [BLOB - 569 B]    [BLOB - 365 B]    [BLOB - 31 B]    [BLOB - 117 B]
   Edit    Delete    9    Archangel         Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Zoroastrianism.    Angel, Israfel, Gabriel, Michael, Azrael    127    [BLOB - 1.2   KiB]    [BLOB - 346 B]    [BLOB - 22 B]    [BLOB - 91 B]
   Edit    Delete    53    Ananta    Shesha, Ananta Shesha    Hindu Religion    Vishnu    145    [BLOB - 766 B]    [BLOB - 390 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 188 B]
   Edit    Delete    52    Anat    â€˜Anat, Antit, Anit, Anti, Anant    Northwest Semitic Mythology         144    [BLOB - 576 B]    [BLOB - 241 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 80 B]
   Edit    Delete    54    Anubis    Anpu, Anup, Anupu, Wip, Ienpw, Inepu, Yinepu, Inpw, Sekhem Em Pet    Egyptian Mythology         146    [BLOB - 2.2   KiB]    [BLOB - 270 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 172 B]
   Edit    Delete    41    Armaiti    Spenta Armaiti    Zoroastrianism, Persian/Middle Eastern Religion         131    [BLOB - 1.1   KiB]    [BLOB - 289 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 262 B]
   Edit    Delete    18    Azrael    Izrail, Azrail, Ashriel, Azaril, Azriel    Islam Religion         141    [BLOB - 1.7   KiB]    [BLOB - 147 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 59 B]
   Edit    Delete    7    Incubus         Western Medieval Legend    Succubus    173    [BLOB - 375 B]    [BLOB - 286 B]    [BLOB - 10 B]    [BLOB - 114 B]
   Edit    Delete    23    Cait Sith    Cat Sidhe, Cait Sidhe    Celtic Mythology              [BLOB - 1.6   KiB]    [BLOB - 141 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 277 B]
   Edit    Delete    33    Betelgeuse    Beetlejuice    Astronomy, Tim Burton's "Beetlejuice"              [BLOB - 596 B]    [BLOB - 219 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 62 B]
   Edit    Delete    31    Frankie    Frankenstein's Monster    Mary Shelley's "Frankenstein"              [BLOB - 1.7   KiB]    [BLOB - 223 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 115 B]
   Edit    Delete    34    Gagison         The Grimoire "The Book of the Sacred Magic of Abramelin the Mage"              [BLOB - 1.2   KiB]    [BLOB - 228 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 272 B]
   Edit    Delete    50    Atys    Attis    Phrygian Mythology    Cybele    143    [BLOB - 1.4   KiB]    [BLOB - 229 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 151 B]
   Edit    Delete    10    Ghoul         Arabian Folklore         206    [BLOB - 1.0   KiB]    [BLOB - 141 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 58 B]
   Edit    Delete    55    Apis    Hapis, Hapi-Ankh    Egyptian Mythology    Ptah, Osiris    147    [BLOB - 2.7   KiB]    [BLOB - 276 B]    [BLOB - 22 B]    [BLOB - 211 B]
   Edit    Delete    12    Queen Mab         English Folklore    Pixie, High Pixie         [BLOB - 465 B]    [BLOB - 296 B]    [BLOB - 22 B]    [BLOB - 146 B]
   Edit    Delete    43    Erl-king    Erlking, Erlkönig    German and Scandanavian Folklore         130    [BLOB - 1.0   KiB]    [BLOB - 220 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 100 B]
   Edit    Delete    32    Demi-Nandi    Nandi, Nahndi, Nandi Bull    Hindu Religion    Shiva         [BLOB - 895 B]    [BLOB - 249 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 91 B]
   Edit    Delete    44    Airavata    Ardha-Matanga, Naga-malla, Arkasodara    Hindu Religion         132    [BLOB - 1.4   KiB]    [BLOB - 246 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 166 B]
   Edit    Delete    16    Camazotz    Cama-Zotz, Sotz, Zotz    Mayan Mythology         180    [BLOB - 772 B]    [BLOB - 194 B]    [BLOB - 10 B]    [BLOB - 98 B]
   Edit    Delete    6    Jack Frost         European Folklore    King Frost         [BLOB - 758 B]    [BLOB - 352 B]    [BLOB - 61 B]    [BLOB - 63 B]
   Edit    Delete    39    Jiraiya         Japanese Folk Legend              [BLOB - 409 B]    [BLOB - 191 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 96 B]
   Edit    Delete    27    Knocker    Knackers, Bwca, Bucca, Tommyknockers    Welsh/Cornish Folklore    Brownies, Dwarves, Leprechauns         [BLOB - 1.4   KiB]    [BLOB - 233 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 177 B]
   Edit    Delete    40    Kugutsushi         Japanese Folk Legend              [BLOB - 228 B]    [BLOB - 177 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 161 B]
   Edit    Delete    15    Azazel    Aziel, Azael, Asiel, Hazazel    Judeo-Christian and Muslim Relgion         137    [BLOB - 1.1   KiB]    [BLOB - 178 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 131 B]
   Edit    Delete    4    Pixie         English Folklore    High Pixie, Queen Mab         [BLOB - 1.5   KiB]    [BLOB - 523 B]    [BLOB - 61 B]    [BLOB - 73 B]
   Edit    Delete    13    Raiju         Japanese Shinto Mythology              [BLOB - 640 B]    [BLOB - 162 B]    [BLOB - 22 B]    [BLOB - 58 B]
   Edit    Delete    8    Succubus         Western Medieval Legend    Incubus         [BLOB - 967 B]    [BLOB - 139 B]    [BLOB - 26 B]    [BLOB - 100 B]
   Edit    Delete    24    Cu Sith    Cusith    Gaelic Mythology              [BLOB - 865 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 60 B]
   Edit    Delete    25    Empousa    Empusa    Greek Mythology    Lamia         [BLOB - 522 B]    [BLOB - 184 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 99 B]
   Edit    Delete    11    High Pixie         English Folklore    Pixie, Queen Mab         [BLOB - 261 B]    [BLOB - 149 B]    [BLOB - 22 B]    [BLOB - 69 B]
   Edit    Delete    51    Aaman    Ammit, Ammut, Ahemait    Egyptian Mythology         129    [BLOB - 2.3   KiB]    [BLOB - 340 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 96 B]
   Edit    Delete    14    Asp         Egyptian         139    [BLOB - 776 B]    [BLOB - 184 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 66 B]
   Edit    Delete    49    Azumi    Azumi-no-isora    Japanese Shinto Mythology         140    [BLOB - 219 B]    [BLOB - 154 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 67 B]
   Edit    Delete    17    Thrones    Ophanim    Christianity         245    [BLOB - 251 B]    [BLOB - 178 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 100 B]
   Edit    Delete    35    Ukobach         Judeo-Christian Myth              [BLOB - 211 B]    [BLOB - 178 B]    [BLOB - 21 B]    [BLOB - 127 B]
   Edit    Delete    22    Zaccoum    Zaqqm    Islam Religion, Qu'ran         215    [BLOB - 817 B]    [BLOB - 131 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 294 B]
   Edit    Delete    57    Kodama         Japanese/Shinto folklore    hamadryads         [BLOB - 223 B]    [BLOB - 448 B]    [BLOB - 0 B]    [BLOB - 72 B]

I noticed the writings while backing up the database (I'm doing a major backup initiative for 2009)

I didn't notice them before because they're stored as binary for some reason (the BLOB columns)

I'll try to post that stuff (the Blobs) somewhere sooner or later (not necessarily on the main site) ...I dunno for sure if Tony for sure wrote the stuff up, but it doesn't look like copy/pasted info. Someone else could've been responsible, but it seems like Tony did most everything writing wise at least for the old website. Personally I feel like I've done enough so far to get to take a few years off :sweatdrop:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on January 05, 2009, 10:58:12 AM
Sorry to keep you waiting. I already deleted all the spaces between the skill names.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on January 05, 2009, 01:09:04 PM
Don't mind waiting as long as time keeps moving forward :rolleyes:


Awesome! I'll update the database asap (sometime in the next couple hours)

This will make many more of the English and Japanese skill names show up.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on January 05, 2009, 03:04:22 PM
Good timing with this.... turns out yesterday I broke the links to the Persona lightbox pages when I changed the name of the About Lightbox page :sick:

PS: On the way in here, I noticed it looks like DevilRy finally found his way back... must've been stuck turning tricks for Old St. Nick :rolleyes:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: Emilio Morales on January 05, 2009, 06:12:17 PM
Good timing with this.... turns out yesterday I broke the links to the Persona lightbox pages when I changed the name of the About Lightbox page :sick:

Phew! I'm glad! :biggrin:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on January 06, 2009, 12:39:38 AM
Me too :sweatdrop:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on January 19, 2009, 11:04:38 PM
I finally fixed an import bug that made Enbarr's skill list not show up. Apparently PHP evaluates "0" (the string sans quotes) as false, which seems really crazy to me, but probably has more pros than cons given the nature of PHP programming. Definitely something that should be on the front page of any PHP manual :confused:

Next I want to try to make the background images preload so when you hit next you don't go to a black background. And I gotta fix the javascript bug that makes the last Persona in the gallery not display in the popup. After this, I will feel like this database is ready for the show floor... EXCEPT! for the database isn't ready. So it will be up to our contributing users to help us complete the database as usual :doh:

It would also be nice to figure something out about working the cards into the popup layout. Mostly I just need someone to rename all of the card files. Oh and I want to make the layout scale around the font size. That is something else I will handle personally. The other stuff I need help with though if this page is ever gonna get out of "under construction" and into the Persona section of the website etcetera etcetera :smokin:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/construction/persona/

Seriously peoples, I can't do everything myself :hearton:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on February 11, 2009, 05:51:01 AM
OK!

I fixed the final popup bug. And I also have the images preloading now, so the background won't be black if they've had time to load...

(actually, the biggest hurdle there was realizing the graphics were technically backgrounds and not images :doh:)

So pretty much the core demonary technology is completely finished I think!

I think we should retire this thread too, and make threads for particular databases from now on.


I still need to work out more sorting options for Persona 1, but it's pretty much just a question of filling in the spreadsheets from here on out. So I gotta ask, if we still want to do this or not??? :rolleyes:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on April 24, 2009, 02:57:15 AM
Sorry to drag this old dog out... but I'd like to know the present sentiment about the whole database half of the "digital devil database"??

I thought I worked out a very efficient system for turning this place into an actual database... the test database went well I thought, but the interest in actual devil databases seemed to drop to nil during the entire process.

I'd just like to know if there is anything I could do to make it easier to add databases to the website. Google Spreadsheet is way more sophisticated than anything I could devise, and I basically take care of everything else.

If you want, we can try to switch over to using the wiki I setup...

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/hell/index.php?title=Welcome_to_Hell

Or at least do a test database from it. Then I can Ajax the wiki pages to import the databases. I don't think that would be more efficient, but it might go over better with volunteers for whatever reasons a psychoanalyst could turn up :rainbow:

I was going to use that wiki for images, before I got the idea to develop the whole Media Library section into something bigger (which I still have on the drawing board)

I dunno, just seems a shame we don't have more happening in the database dept.

PS: Also Persona PSP is coming out, so it should behoove us to at least finish the P1 database in time :sweatdrop:

http://www.digitaldevildb.com/demonary/velvet-room/persona/


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: wolfzau on May 09, 2009, 09:03:35 AM
I'd be willing to help out since the Persona series was the whole damn reason I got involved in Megaten in the first place (that, and anything that'll give me a better reason as to why my translations are so slow  :tongue:)

Personally I'd love to see a demon database (as would most fans probably, even though they are somewhat silent) What exactly do you need? If I can help in any way I will


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on May 10, 2009, 12:54:58 AM
The two major things we need are Japanese/translated names for stuff (mostly magic) entered into our Google Spreadsheet. And after Atlus USA does it's thing with PSP edition, we'll need the new names it will be using (don't expect them to stick with the Revelations names do you!!)

Then we need to have the tarot card graphics named to match the background graphics so I can add that to the presentation. Then I can finish up the rest of the programming. If we want to go beyond just Persona info, then there is a lot that could be done.


The Google Spreadsheets are here (http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=piKSlpkg0llAny-VoXNRkKQ&hl=en)

Pick Persona on the bottom to get to the Persona sheet. It might seem a bit much at first, but it's really the easiest way to do this more or less. However we're really finished with the Persona sheet. What we really need is work in the Stock Terms sheet. Which is basic translation stuff that would apply to most every game. Then after that is finished it can just be copied over into the Persona sheet. There are Persona exclusive terms however. For now though it's probably easiest to just put everything into the stock terms sheet. Later when we have more than one game DB we can copy and prune it to make a general terms sheet(s).

Really I should reprogram the database so the terminology is a separate table. But for now this is easier. The main reason we have the terms in a separate spreadsheet is because Google won't let you sort a subset a rows, so this way you can just enter the terms willy nilly, then sort the row you want, then copy it into another sheet sorted. They don't have to be sorted, but it makes double entries less likely (once we get the bulk stuff in there)

Translation: If you just fill out the stock terms sheet I can do the rest. If you want to help rename the tarot cards, I can think of some way to facilitate that.

PS: To sort, just click the little boxes in the divider over the column you want to sort. Oh and I'll invite you to work on the spreadsheet by email if you still wanna try and help...

PPS: Also, I really don't care how the Japanese names are transliterated into English. But since I did what is there myself, I did it the way I thought was best. Whoever finishes the job can do it however the hell they like.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: wolfzau on May 11, 2009, 09:07:03 AM
Yeah send me an email, managed to locate an Eternal Punishment magic list with the Japanese translations so should be able to at least contribute something to it


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on May 13, 2009, 02:36:05 PM
^Well, we don't have an EP page yet, though we do have a spreadsheet for it. Thing is we don't have a P2 section on the website yet, so probably an EP database would be hard to find, though I'm planning on adding a "Special Features" page, so people can go straight to the databases.

Emilio entered everything into these spreadsheets more or less single handedly. I translated the deity names into academic English. Emilio seems to have stopped short with translating everything though. Especially since Revelations doesn't even resemble a Megaten game terminology wise, it seems imperative to translate everything. If you can do the translating work, I'll pitch in and finish the tarot card graphics myself... just to get this all over with. I of course programmed everything... which was a lot of work, being our first database (and the first time the content of the site ever truly lived up to it's name :tongue:)

Anyway, we have a number of helpful links near the top of the Megami Ibunroku (Persona 1) spreadsheet. Everything you need to know is probably in one of those links. I'll go ahead and invite you to work on the spreadsheets, and I'll try to make sure you're working with them correctly once you get started. But like I said, probably you don't need to edit the Persona spreadsheet now. We really need work on the Stock Terms spreadsheet before we can move the Persona database out of the "Under Construction" section. Let me send you that email...


PS: Thanks for your continued support~


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: wolfzau on May 18, 2009, 06:39:06 PM

Had a look at it and translating it shouldn't be too much of a hassle (I hope). But before I get started I just wanna be clear....am I fill in the blank Localizations? or is it something else.... :confused:


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on May 19, 2009, 05:18:27 PM
I think what primarily needs doing is to just add rows to the terms table for all the classic stuff like Agi, Bufu, etc. Of course I already did a number of those (can't recall how far I got) ...then there are also a lot of extended magic families, and non-classifiable skills also that can just be tossed into the same bunch. The first field I think is for the Revelations skill name for now. Then there is just Japanese (in romaji -- maybe in kanji/hiragana as well... can't recall) ....and finally there is a field for just a straight best we can do English translation (edited: oh yeah, and don't forget original Japanese game names)

The goal is just to make sure when people are browsing the Megami Ibunroku database, there are no unnamed skills (in each of the three presentations; Revelations, Original, and Unofficial English Translation)

There will be a fourth for Atlus USA's PSP translation after that happens as well. If the reader is viewing the website in Spanish, then they will see Unofficial Spanish Translation instead... but that type of translation will be handled by a different database, so no need to think of it for now.

In short, we just need all the Megami Ibunroku skills indexed :sweatdrop:


^And later we can do the same for devils, items, etcetera :doh:


Edited: You can leave anything you're uncomfortable with blank. It's most important to just get the rows in there.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: wolfzau on May 20, 2009, 01:55:32 PM
Okay, I'll be honest.

Still don't think I get it completely but I've had a whack at it so you can tell me what you think.
Added over 150 skills to the list, many of which are already on there but it seemed easier to me to just start from scratch rather than sift through the list looking for ones that weren't on there  :tongue:

Depending on what you think I can always change it later

Basically put the English name, Japanese name (whether it be hiragana or katakana, it was whichever I could find) and the romaji equivalent. Also in the notes section I put down what game they were in. If it's general that means that all games have them (I think) and if it was specific to a series I put the name of the game.

It's not all done of course but I figured it was a start.  :rainbow:

I do have one question though, it seems that in some of the earlier games the same skills were spelt differently e.g Agirao as opposed to Agilao. In those instances do you want me to enter both and specify which game they starred in or shall I just leave it as is.

Also, I left the Localizations row blank as I'm not sure what to put in, skill type maybe?

Anyways...have a look and if I've done anything wrong I'll be happy to change it  :biggrin:

EDIT: Wait....think I get it now, translate the Japanese names into the literal meaning and stick em in Localizations, right?

EDIT 2: Oh, and the skills I added start beneath the previously entered ones, the ones without localizations. Ya can't miss them




Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on May 20, 2009, 05:06:01 PM
You can sort any column alphabetically to help you find what's been entered previously entered (but only in the uniform Stock Terms spreadsheet -- a sort in the others will fuck up everything / require a rewind :wink:)

About however Atlus USA localized stuff, just leave that blank or stick whatever in there. The idea is just to fill out the list so it can be copy pasted into other game specific spreadsheets, then fill in the game appropriate translations in the other spreadsheet, and delete anything that doesn't belong (though extra stuff doesn't hurt anything)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on May 20, 2009, 05:13:45 PM
Yeah, the Translations column is not Atlus USA localizations. That column is for unofficial translations (which we assign democratically or whatever)

The Atlus USA translations aren't needed in this spreadsheet, but if you want you can stick something in the first column just for reference. That column is there because it has to be, or the copy over won't work right.

Copious notes are great. Entries don't have to be spells either. Just put what it is in the function section (devil, persona, item, skill, whatever makes explicit sense I can accommodate)

If you want to add some helpful info after a Japanese cell just put it in square brackets and it will be ignored. Like if a skill is in Kanji and you want to add the kana to help people read / look it up, just put it in brackets (edited: currently we're using [], which is easier to detect, but I can probably do 「」 as well if I gotta)

If there are any skills that are actually spelled different in the Japanese games (I don't think there will be other than some games having kanji and some not) then we might develop a new notation at that time (a double entry won't hurt though)

You're doing a fine job :rainbow:


PS: Personally I prefer Jio to Zio for an unofficial translation because it's more modern and because it's easier to use shorthand notation (A,B,J,Z) than (A,B,Z,Z) :rolleyes:

But the ball is in the court of whoever does the work as far as I'm personally concerned (Jio also sounds like Geo, which is very Earth elementally :tongue:)


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on May 21, 2009, 06:52:53 PM
To be honest.... I'm still not convinced this Google Spreadsheets webapp is reliable enough to keep using this way.

I'm trying to make the page you're working on longer (more empty rows to fill in) and still haven't been able to get it to work...

I'm going to try with Google Chrome, then give up. Maybe if your internet is better you might have better odds of pulling this off...


But remember, you gotta keep making the spreadsheet longer, and its best to do it before you get too close to the bottom.


Title: Re: Need help with your Demonary?
Post by: yksehtniycul on May 21, 2009, 07:01:01 PM
^Google Chrome definitely seems more responsive.... you probably wanna at least try downloading Chrome and using it with Google Spreadsheets...

I do recall in the past however, using Chrome would make you do shit you didn't want to do, but you could always hit undo afterward and keep going.


Anyway, I've given you some breathing room if you wanna keep going :smokin: